Philosophical arguments against Christian God


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Reverse_Dragon is offline Reverse_Dragon Post #11  January 19,2012, 2:46pm
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Only one? Fornication and dissent are two of my favorite things. And anger has a place in a moral lifestyle, so long as that anger is righteous.
 
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Reverse_Dragon is offline Reverse_Dragon Post #12  January 19,2012, 2:58pm
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dowahsippydo wrote :
The basis of Christianity is salvation through acknowledging Jesus' sacrifice for your sins.
On the contrary. The basis of Christianity is a desire for enslavement. Christians desires the comforting control of a parent who never dies, never sleeps, and never pushes you from the nest. He is always there watching, judging, and controlling. They believe that they are God's property, their lives his creation and in his total control. This frees them from any responsibility for their own lives and their own fate. It is a desire for totalitarianism. The desire to have all burdens and duties removed from them, that they might live the simple lives of children and slaves.

Their argument that he is a loving enslaver, showing compassion in his mastery of everything and everyone, is eerily, though unsurprisingly, reminiscent of the protests of an Uncle Tom slave or a kidnap victim with Stockholm syndrome.
 
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llw11 is offline llw11 Post #13  January 19,2012, 4:34pm
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Reverse_Dragon wrote :
On the contrary. The basis of Christianity is a desire for enslavement. Christians desires the comforting control of a parent who never dies, never sleeps, and never pushes you from the nest. He is always there watching, judging, and controlling. They believe that they are God's property, their lives his creation and in his total control. This frees them from any responsibility for their own lives and their own fate. It is a desire for totalitarianism. The desire to have all burdens and duties removed from them, that they might live the simple lives of children and slaves.

Their argument that he is a loving enslaver, showing compassion in his mastery of everything and everyone, is eerily, though unsurprisingly, reminiscent of the protests of an Uncle Tom slave or a kidnap victim with Stockholm syndrome.
...definitely carrying the torch for hitchens, .

i agree with everything though.
 
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dowahsippydo is offline dowahsippydo Post #14  January 20,2012, 2:57am
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shapeShifter79 wrote :
The Catholic church's list of sins includes--"fornication, impurity, licentiousness, idolatry, sorcery, enmity, strife, jealousy, anger, selfishness, dissension, factions, envy..."

If we're restricting our discussion to only those of age and capable to "make a choice to accept jesus", I see only the "Saved" or "Sinners" and question whether this third category "The Default" that you say would go to Hell according to most Catholics exists. Try to imagine a human being who is of age and capable of making a choice to accept or reject Jesus, who has never been angry, selfish, or jealous. And who are supposedly condemned! (Note--those never exposed to "the word" can't "make a choice to accept Jesus" and aren't considered condemned).

What happens to a non-existant group of people can hardly be used as an argument against God's love.

If you wish to invoke such people, the burden rests on you to identify them.
I would suggest people who have never been exposed to Christianity. As an example, people in remote regions with little contact with the outside world. I admit that in this day and age such a group may be very small, but this is a group that fall into the "default." They would be capable of making a decision but are unaware that such a decision exists. They have never heard of Jesus. Since they do not accept Jesus as their savior, they would be sent to hell.
 
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shapeShifter79 is offline shapeShifter79 Post #15  January 20,2012, 7:54am
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dowahsippydo wrote :
I would suggest people who have never been exposed to Christianity. As an example, people in remote regions with little contact with the outside world. I admit that in this day and age such a group may be very small, but this is a group that fall into the "default." They would be capable of making a decision but are unaware that such a decision exists. They have never heard of Jesus. Since they do not accept Jesus as their savior, they would be sent to hell.
You seem to have missed the parenthetical end of my message where I anticipated and addressed this objection. To be more precise, see Lumen Gentium or the catechisms, which directly contradict your claim that "Since they do not accept Jesus as their savior, they would be sent to hell."

Lumen Gentium wrote :
Those also can attain to salvation who through no fault of their own do not know the Gospel of Christ or His Church
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shapeShifter79 is offline shapeShifter79 Post #16  January 20,2012, 8:45am
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Reverse_Dragon wrote :
Only one? Fornication and dissent are two of my favorite things. And anger has a place in a moral lifestyle, so long as that anger is righteous.
lol. Fornication is one of my favorite things to do! And I agree, anger and dissent can be fruitful. I only elevate one of these sins to the level of virtue, although, many of them are far from objectionable to me.
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notamaninpower is offline notamaninpower Post #17  January 20,2012, 11:50am
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Reverse_Dragon wrote :
On the contrary. The basis of Christianity is a desire for enslavement. Christians desires the comforting control of a parent who never dies, never sleeps, and never pushes you from the nest. He is always there watching, judging, and controlling. They believe that they are God's property, their lives his creation and in his total control. This frees them from any responsibility for their own lives and their own fate. It is a desire for totalitarianism. The desire to have all burdens and duties removed from them, that they might live the simple lives of children and slaves.

Their argument that he is a loving enslaver, showing compassion in his mastery of everything and everyone, is eerily, though unsurprisingly, reminiscent of the protests of an Uncle Tom slave or a kidnap victim with Stockholm syndrome.
My thoughts are that the WHOLE thing (AND the 'sacred', written by mortal, earth-bound HUMANS, KJV {and others} bible) was invented by meglomaniacal men who wanted, needed, and were COMPELLED to gain that ultimate control and power.
Last edited by notamaninpower; January 20,2012 at 11:52am.
 
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Reverse_Dragon is offline Reverse_Dragon Post #18  January 20,2012, 5:35pm
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llw11 wrote :
...definitely carrying the torch for hitchens, .

i agree with everything though.
Ahh... Hitchens. Sigh.

Why is the voices this world needs the most are always the ones who are silenced too early?
 
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Reverse_Dragon is offline Reverse_Dragon Post #19  January 20,2012, 5:39pm
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Arg. Why is IT the voices blah blah blah.

Can we fix the editing thing already? E-mail me the code and I'll do it myself.
 
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