eHA_Admin_Lori is offline eHA_Admin_Lori — Advice Official Moderator Post #1  December 18,2009, 10:31am
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Heated debate again over 'War on Christmas' claims - CNN.com

What do you guys think? Are things like declarations of "Happy Holidays" (as opposed to "Merry Christmas" devaluing the spirit and religious significance of Christmas?

Are you offended when someone wishes you "Happy Holidays" instead of "Merry Christmas"?
 
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notyet is offline notyet Post #2  December 18,2009, 6:40pm
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eHA_Admin_Lori wrote :
...What do you guys think? Are things like declarations of "Happy Holidays" (as opposed to "Merry Christmas" devaluing the spirit and religious significance of Christmas?

Are you offended when someone wishes you "Happy Holidays" instead of "Merry Christmas"?
am i offended? no.

is the spiritual significance of the holiday devalued when we can no longer wish each other "merry christmas" for fear that someone will be offended? absolutely.

btw, i wished everyone in my secular office today "merry christmas" and "happy new year" before i walked out of my office to start my two week vacation.

the holiday is christmas. yes, there is chanukkah- and some celebrate kwanzaa- although i hear less and less of that all the time. but the reason we all have off the 25th of december is because that is the day we celebrate the birth of christ.

the 24th of kislev was not a national holiday (holy day) in america. (anyone know what day that was on the gregorian calendar? i did not think so...) does anyone even know when kwanzaa starts?

waiting...

waiting...

the reason for the season is the birth of the messiah. the jewish messiah. my messiah. yours too, if you accept him.

about this messiah, the apostle john wrote,

"He is the atoning sacrifice for our sins, and not only for ours but also for the sins of the whole world."

1 john 2:2

we celebrate his birth here in the west on december 25th. was that when he was born? i doubt it. but it is as good a day as any. if i really knew when he was born, i'd celebrate that day instead. but i don't. so i celebrate the 25th.

it is not as religiously significant as resurrection day. but it is festive and colorful and fun- and religiously significant.

no birth, no death. no death, no resurrection. no resurrection, no ascension. no ascension, no interceding for you and me from the right hand of god.

i think i'll celebrate christmas and the gift of salvation from god to whosoever will...

MERRY CHRISTMAS!!!!!!!!
Last edited by notyet; December 18,2009 at 7:04pm.
 
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BuzWeaver is offline BuzWeaver Post #3  December 18,2009, 6:53pm
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The dynamics of any kind of 'waring' on anything has been made all the more profound by the fact that the internet is now a vehicle for spreading whatever kind of message you want to a wide audience.

There was a time where you had to work your way into the media to be able to express your ideals or write a book, now we have the World Wide Web! As we saw today Tweeter was hacked by the Iranian Cyber Army. It had a very interesting effect.

I appear to be going off on a tangent, anyhoo, suffices to say that much has been said about the war on Christmas, but more accurately I'd say its more about the war on Christianity. A lot of this comes from a very vocal but small minority of people.
 
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Wonderwoman402 is offline Wonderwoman402 Post #4  December 18,2009, 7:30pm
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There is only a "war on Christmas" in the minds of a few fundamentalist Christians who want everyone to believe as they do.

How exactly is Christmas devalued by recognizing that there are also other holidays occurring this time of year and wishing that everyone enjoy the season? The greeting "Happy Holidays" includes the Christmas holiday, so how would that possibly be considered offensive by Christians?

Why is it so important to Christians that their holiday be observed in public school programs? Don't they get enough of it at their churches and Sunday School programs... where it would be more meaningful to them to be celebrating amongst others who share their beliefs?

Besides, the Christians created Christmas to steal the attention away from the Pagans!
 
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jsbach is offline jsbach Post #5  December 18,2009, 8:09pm
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I am not offended by a "Happy Holidays" greeting. I do prefer saying Merry Christmas!

I am offended when some retail establishments forbid their employees from saying "Merry Christmas" to their customers. The same stores that reap a huge monetary benefit from the celebrating of Christmas cannot allow their clerks to give a traditional Christmas greeting? Please!

Btw, I believe Kwanzaa is celebrated in the days sandwiched by Christmas and New Year's.

It seems perfectly reasonable in America to be able to give out a greeting of your choice. Whether Christian, Hindu, Muslim, Jew, Atheist etc... .
Last edited by jsbach; December 18,2009 at 8:14pm. Reason: So many thoughts, so little time!
 
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notyet is offline notyet Post #6  December 18,2009, 8:36pm
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Wonderwoman402 wrote :
There is only a "war on Christmas" in the minds of a few fundamentalist Christians who want everyone to believe as they do.

How exactly is Christmas devalued by recognizing that there are also other holidays occurring this time of year and wishing that everyone enjoy the season? The greeting "Happy Holidays" includes the Christmas holiday, so how would that possibly be considered offensive by Christians?

Why is it so important to Christians that their holiday be observed in public school programs? Don't they get enough of it at their churches and Sunday School programs... where it would be more meaningful to them to be celebrating amongst others who share their beliefs?

Besides, the Christians created Christmas to steal the attention away from the Pagans!
i know you know that you live in a country that has chosen to celebrate christmas as a legal national holiday, right? so there should be nothing wrong with recognizing that at city hall and yes, in the public schools. in that context, it is amazing that creches are allowed to create such a stir. the entire federal government comes to a halt on december 25th in honor of the birth of christ.

kwanzaa- not a national holiday.

chanukkah- not a national holiday.

winter solstice- not a national holiday.

Christmas? declared a national holiday by us grant, the president of the united states, in 1870.

if it offends so much, lobby congress and have the holiday changed.

let me know how that works out for you.
Last edited by notyet; December 18,2009 at 9:18pm. Reason: typo...
 
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Ephemera is offline Ephemera Post #7  December 18,2009, 8:39pm
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I'm with WonderWoman on this one. The winter solstice was the celebration and it so alarmed the christian church that they chose it as the time to insert the birth of jesus myth. They did the same with Ostara by inserting the rising from the dead myth and calling it Easter. Don't get me wrong - I love Christmas, but I don't look upon it as a christian holiday but instead as a celebration of the universe and nature far pre-dating the inception of christianity. It is a celebration of the coming of longer days, the rebirth of the sun. The magic in the air at this time of year is a treasure and no matter what holiday you are celebrating, it's the love and the caring that are the true celebration. Onward to spring!
 
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Wonderwoman402 is offline Wonderwoman402 Post #8  December 18,2009, 9:46pm
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notyet wrote :
....if it offends so much, lobby congress and have the holiday changed.

let me know how that works out for you.
Where did I say I was offended? And I certainly didn't complain about getting the day off work! LOL!! I only questioned why it should be offensive to Christians to say "Happy Holidays" which includes the Christmas holiday?

I am not offended, and the whole holiday season works just fine for me. I celebrated Hanukah last week with my Jewish friends. My Christmas tree is up. Certain Christmas carols move me to the point of tears. I look forward to Winter Solstice... when from that day forward every day becomes a bit brighter. I love New Year's... a time to reflect on the past year and celebrate new beginnings.

For me, Christmas is a holy day... and EVERY day a child is born is a holy day.

Merry Christmas, and Happy Holidays to you!
 
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cardguy is offline cardguy Post #9  December 18,2009, 11:03pm
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I always say Merry Christmas myself, but I'm not going to get up in arms about the use of Happy Holidays. If there is a war on Christmas, in my mind it has more to do with credit cards than political correctness. Not that there's anything wrong with giving gifts by any means, just with stores pushing that as the metric by which love is measured during this time of Advent.
 
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blessedinNC is offline blessedinNC Post #10  December 19,2009, 7:37am
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In general, I think our society devalued the spirit and religious significance long before it became popular to say "Happy Holidays" instead of "Merry Christmas". If this time of year is not about Christmas for a particular individual, or that individual chooses to celebrate the commercial aspect of Christmas but wants to make a point of distancing themselves from being associated Christ - then I see no purpose in expecting them to greet anyone with "Merry Christmas". The spiritual meaning of Christmas (and anything else to do with Christianity) is about what is in the individual's heart, not what about the words they say.

I do find it troubling when employers do not allow employees to use "Merry Christmas" - and frankly I do not understand why it is so offending. I say "Merry Christmas". If someone greets me back with according to the custom of another holiday they are celebrating (like chanukkah or kwanzaa) - I will respond by returning the greeting of their custom. They in turn say "Merry Christmas". Basically, two civilized people respectfully and happily greet each other with the well wishes of their own holiday and the holiday the other is celebrating. I work with many people who are from other countries who celebrate other holidays of religious significance to them. Throughout the year if they are celebrating, they will greet me according to their custom, and I return the greeting. I am not in the least offended by this exchange. Since when does the politically correct state of neutrality trump plain old good manners ?

I've noticed in my area it seems the employees in the stores are allowed to say "Merry Christmas" if the customer says it first. To that end, I always start with "Merry Christmas" to give the person ringing up my purchases an opportunity to respond with a Christmas greeting if they would prefer. (I am not only offended - but also saddened that in this country which boasts of its freedom some people are actually not allowed to say "Merry Christmas" for fear of losing their jobs)

This year I did as much of my shopping as I could at a Christian store which sells a nice variety of items - and had a gigantic "Merry Christmas" painted on the windows.

I wish you all a Merry Christmas !
 
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