tumbleweed is offline tumbleweed Post #21  February 26,2009, 9:26pm
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beatlejuice72, wrote :

This is a true story. A woman I used to date who is an atheist saw a Nativity display. She took one look at it, scoffed and said "That is so gay." Now, this is a woman who has a brother that is gay. Personally, I don't like comments like this because I think they are stupid and insensitive towards gay people. But what really strikes me is listening to so many of these atheists in the world who claim to be "open-minded" and "tolerant" yet they're the first ones to barge into your forum, your church or ministry shouting out at you because you're religious or spiritual. Yep, verrrry open-minded alright.

I also love it when they preach about the First Amendment and how it applies to them and their rights yet somehow that same privilege doesn't extend to those of us who believe that there is Freedom of Religion in the Constitution. Oh, sure, they don't mind if we pray out loud or silently. Just as long as we do it inside with the doors locked and so nobody outdoors can hear anything.

I'm not interested in converting anyone and I learned long ago that it was pointless and futile to even try it. But can somebody explain to me why some people feel it is their God-given right or science-given right to personally attack religious people for their beliefs? For some reason it's mostly the Christians that get attacked and very seldom is it any other religious group although they get attacked, too. If you don't like religion, fine. But coming to a religious message board or website to litter it with anti-religious propaganda and hate speech says more about you than anything you could ever say or think about religion and spirituality.

You are the ones always telling people how open-minded and tolerant you are. Prove it.
i wouldnt go as far as to say it was futile this would be giving up on your fellow man , i have found that actions speak louder than words, practice what you preach, what did jesus say when under atack or being taken from? its not my place to judge but when called apone i will serve. we are all differant and can serve in differant ways if someone stumbles in front of you, dont you offer a hand in support, it dosent matter who or what the believe in , they are in need of your help and you have been placed there, i have some freinds who are vary high up in the science world and none of them would ever atack religion that way, they know better, most of your atacker i believe are insecure with there own world, one of the big keys is understanding
 
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mylife_myway is offline mylife_myway Post #22  April 16,2009, 12:16pm
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dwreese182,489197 wrote :

abjon,488671 wrote :


When push comes to shove atheist prove that they are just as close minded as any conservative, legalistc fundamentalist Christian.


Are you talking about Atheists as a whole? You have met every single Atheist that has every walked the face of the earth to come to this conclusion? Just curious. You make a comparison of ALL Atheists to a very specific type of Christian. Why is that?
abjon,488671 wrote :


When push comes to shove atheist prove that they are just as close minded as any conservative, legalistc fundamentalist Christian.


That's just like saying that all theist are closed-minded Christains.


That's your opnion you can't prove that we all are.


Sorry, but I don't agree with you at all, Im an Atheist but i'm open-minded, just because i don't believe in god doesn't mean i won't listen to anybody's elses beliefs or try and understand where they are coming from.By the wayi'm not conservative, i'm labour.


That's just like saying
 
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The27thS is offline The27thS Post #23  April 16,2009, 4:23pm
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There is a difference between "atheist" and "antitheist." Christopher Hitchens who is one of the most beligerant atheists openly classifies himself as an antitheist.
 
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BuzWeaver is offline BuzWeaver Post #24  April 20,2009, 6:02pm
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I'm not all that concerned if an Atheist is open minded, I'm more curious as to why they aren't intellectually honest.
 
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eek is offline eek Post #25  April 20,2009, 7:45pm
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It's good to be open minded, but not so much that your brain falls out.


Atheists don't belive in God. Why would you expect one to consider a scene depicting Jesus as an opportunity to broaden their spiritual beliefs when they clearly don't believe in such a thing? Calling it gay is just a lack of respect and tact. Do you find magicians ultimately facsinating and let yourself believe that maybe you really can defy Conservation of Energy and make something vanish from existance? Of course you don't, because you are close minded! Give me a break.
 
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james1951 is offline james1951 Post #26  May 19,2009, 9:51am
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To me the word spirit has no supernatural meaning, nor does the bible. The things Jesus spoke about were indeed spiritual but they were not supernatural. The word spirit in its natural sense means
the principle of conscious life; the vital principle in humans, animating the body or mediating between body and soul.
with the definition of soul being
the principle of life, feeling, thought, and action in humans, regarded as a distinct entity separate from the body, and commonly held to be separable in existence from the body; the spiritual part of humans as distinct from the physical part.
and while the feeling and thought part may have to do with the firing of synapses in the brain or something, we are not yet at a level of understanding that would make that a truly physical part of our body. Thinking as apart from doing seperating the mind\soul from the rest of the physical body.. along with the soul definition of..
an individual as characterized by a given attitude, disposition, character, action, etc.: A few brave spirits remained to face the danger.

Now if we consider the spirit of God to simply be the spirit of desiring to be absolutely truthful and righteous (right thinking and doing) which sounds very buddhist I think, the only thing "super natural" about that is that our perception of truth and righteousness is not absolute in any way, but very subjective, however I believe many of us strive as much as we can for absolute truth and righteousness or god.

I believe that all atheists are really offended by is the idea that some religious people think their perception of God is the absolute true god and thus everyone else must abide by what they claim is his Godly instruction or face eternal damnation.

Having said that, it is not too far of from my own perception of the god concept.

Indeed we all have our own perception of absolute truth and if we do not obey that truth it will result in neurosis and psychosis based on feelings of guilt , paranoia, low self esteem, and the like for not being the person we truly believe we should be.

In pauls letter to the Romans chapters 7 and 8, he describes this predicament of not being able to do the things we want to do and doing things we dont really want to. And here is where the seperation of the spirit of God comes from our human spirit. Paul says if I am doing things I do not want to do then it is not me doing them but something else within me. Who will free me from this thing.
Then the psychologist Jesus comes along and says first you must get rid of the fears that stop you from being true to what you believe, that means having faith that the consequences of doing the right thing is worth doing the right thing. You must have faith that you can be free from the guilt and shame of your past wrong doing.
Now you come closer to this spirit of doing the true and right thing or god.

It is the absoluteness of god that seperates us from following this spirit of truth and righteousness, and even that part of truth and righteousness we can see can be driven away from us by fear of the consequences of acting on it.

As I read the heirarchy of human needs as outlined by Maslow I saw that in order top meet our higher needs of love and self actualization, we had to sacrifice our baser needs of food shelter and security. How do you express love without giving of what you have and opening up yourself to the dangers involved in being loving and compassionate. Even the boy scouts shake with their left hand, signifying the laying down of their sheild to form an alliance in the "spirit: of friendship and cooperation.

So while god in a sense deals with the natural spirit of mans higher nature, his absoluteness of truth and righteousness is still far from our ability to posess even with this higher nature but even further from our baser nature that seeks food shelter and security, the seeking after will often cause us to do harn to other humans if we "fear" they are a "threat" to our own security of existence.

I hope some have grasped a bit more clearly who or what god is, at least to me from my reply.
P.S.
Actually God is much more than this to me but that would need further clarification, as it deals with the personification needed to make the desire for absolute truth greater than the fear of the consequences of acting according to the revelation of that truth to me.
Rest assured this means doing only good to others as opposed to what some religious people have done in the name of their god or perception of truth and righteousness.
 
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dwreese182 is offline dwreese182 Post #27  May 20,2009, 4:35pm
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BuzWeaver wrote :
I'm not all that concerned if an Atheist is open minded, I'm more curious as to why they aren't intellectually honest.
I'm not all that concerned if a Christian is open minded, I'm more curious as to why they aren't intellectually honest. (back atchya)
 
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rix is offline rix Post #28  May 20,2009, 5:25pm
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[quote=james1951;612853]





 
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Wootz is offline Wootz Post #29  May 21,2009, 3:28pm
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I’m an atheist. I also happen to be rather easy going, open minded, free thinking, all the rest. Thanks to neardc and others, you’ve pretty much said what I wanted to say. I’ll not preach at you or put you down and belittle you.

And Rix, I still haven’t read those books you mentioned on another thread. I can’t very well respond to literary criticism until I have. *grin* As for the "god shaped vacuum," I seem to have been born missing that particular fossa. To switch metaphors, that would be an odd looking dirt removal device, though.
 
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BuzWeaver is offline BuzWeaver Post #30  May 22,2009, 5:53pm
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dwreese182 wrote :
I'm not all that concerned if a Christian is open minded, I'm more curious as to why they aren't intellectually honest. (back atchya)
You have a gift for arguing the antecedent.
 
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