Diann1950 is online now Diann1950 Post #11  November 8,2009, 5:04am
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Kid and dog sitting, have grand kids and dogs for the week.

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The commercial value of art rarely goes to the artist, Thus speaks the widow of an artist who has a house full of paintings and no decent furniture. My husband was a very good artist, rotten salesman, and repeatedly taken by a series of agents. My response to anyone who is selling what I may think of as overpriced art, is go for it. If you can get someone to buy it, it will only partially make up for all the starving artist years.
 
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WeDesignOurLives is offline WeDesignOurLives Post #12  November 8,2009, 6:39am
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eviegirl wrote :
The true value of a piece of art can only be arrived at by the person that created it, possesses it...or chooses to possess it for a price. It seems to me, WeDesignOurLives, that your question can be answered by your own moniker.
I'm not selling or placing value on the life I design for myself. If I say it's $100 or $100 million no one can contest.

And to that exact point, I don't believe the value, true or not, can be arrived at only by the creator WHEN that creator chooses to request others participate in establishing that value.

... which is an over intellectualized way of saying that more the subjective the thing you're selling the more it's about perceived than 'actual' value (which others here have said better than I).

You go out to dinner...it's $100, just for you... was that dinner 5x better than the $25 meal you had last week? I think if you strive to be objective, no way... in fact that $25 steak likely wasn't 5x better than a Big Mac perhaps.

So what people do is rationalize... cognitive dissonance... they create the reasons they need to bridge their own doubt about the real cost ($$$) and the subjective feel of the experience.

(And I do that too...most everyone does.)

And I guess this topic is asking for people to consider they do that and to try and have a conversation about creating a more objective measure of a subjective experience because I think it's at least partly wrong that a Jackson Pollack can be worth far more than a great Master's Renaissance work simply because he's 'a Beatle' and the other person wasn't.

Artist vs. AsTISTE!
Last edited by WeDesignOurLives; November 8,2009 at 6:41am.
 
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Sassafras54 is offline Sassafras54 — Advice Official Moderator Post #13  November 8,2009, 9:02am
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Isn't everything about "perceived" value? That's why Mad Ave. exists! ... to create perceived need/want.

How would you define an objective value for anything, let alone an artwork?

BTW I like your new avatar ... did you paint that?
 
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eviegirl is offline eviegirl Post #14  November 8,2009, 4:48pm
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WDOL-Actually, I'd have to say that the last few $100 meals I've enjoyed were, in fact, 5x better than the last $20 (which is 1/5 of $100) meal I had.

Now, in hindsight, would I rather have spent a $100 on something more sensible? Probably, yes. But did I get $100 worth of pleasure from that meal? Yes.

The only question I would pose to myself in the future would be, "Is this $100 meal worth more to you than $100 to my local food bank?".

And I think you missed my point about your name. We design our lives in that, if I choose to design my life with Jackson Pollack artwork, or amazing meals, pricey lip-gloss (my vice)...and I am okay with the $$ it costs to do that, then so be it. I'm designing my life that way. You see?
 
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WeDesignOurLives is offline WeDesignOurLives Post #15  November 8,2009, 9:03pm
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Sassafras54 wrote :
Isn't everything about "perceived" value? That's why Mad Ave. exists! ... to create perceived need/want.

How would you define an objective value for anything, let alone an artwork?

BTW I like your new avatar ... did you paint that?
Well one way is elemental.. the human body is worth $1.98 when you break down the elements.

How about 2 fried eggs for $50 for breakfast at a restaurant? You can say it's all perceived but when the item being perceived is a commodity you have so many more people establishing perceived value that you come to agreement.... if 10,000 people were polled about an artwork and there was a close mean value with little deviation then one could say it's a more objective value (because objective really just means agreement... you and I know what a fork is because we agree we know what a fork is when we see one and if it's an 'ordinary' fork we're not going to say it's worth $50 because it's just shaped cheap metal or plastic which we don't put alot of value upon).

I didn't paint the avatar and it's not me.
 
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WeDesignOurLives is offline WeDesignOurLives Post #16  November 8,2009, 9:08pm
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eviegirl wrote :
WDOL-Actually, I'd have to say that the last few $100 meals I've enjoyed were, in fact, 5x better than the last $20 (which is 1/5 of $100) meal I had.

And I think you missed my point about your name. We design our lives in that, if I choose to design my life with Jackson Pollack artwork, or amazing meals, pricey lip-gloss (my vice)...and I am okay with the $$ it costs to do that, then so be it. I'm designing my life that way. You see?
Sorry but I need to ask how you know they were 5x better? (and not only 3x or even perhaps 8x).

Yes, I did miss understand your point about my moniker. But my point still remains in that if you could get the same quality meal for a fraction of the price why would one buy the higher? Sure it's up to you... if you wanted to pay $25 for an ordinary gallon or milk ( $2 for a bottle of water) but is there a way to objectify even the seemingly subjective so one can have an idea that $5000 for a good abstract painting it just right?
 
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Sassafras54 is offline Sassafras54 — Advice Official Moderator Post #17  November 9,2009, 7:38am
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Your idea of polling 10,000 people is probably the only way you'll find an "objective" value to anything. That's basically what retailers do, isn't it? If something is selling hot, they raise the price; if no one's buying, it goes "on sale". They find price points through experimentation, focus groups, research on similar products, etc. ... all ways to basically "poll 10,000 people".

I guess with art it's kind of the same thing ... you stick a price tag on it and if it sells hot then in that artist's next show the price has gone up. If it didn't sell at all the price becomes negotiable.

BTW you can negotiate with art galleries, it's like car dealers.
 
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WeDesignOurLives is offline WeDesignOurLives Post #18  November 9,2009, 3:01pm
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Sassafras54 wrote :
Your idea of polling 10,000 people is probably the only way you'll find an "objective" value to anything.

BTW you can negotiate with art galleries, it's like car dealers.
I agree,,, and as I've often asserted in other threads - objective just means 'agreement'.
 
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WeDesignOurLives is offline WeDesignOurLives Post #19  November 15,2009, 3:38pm
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A Warhol silk screen of 100 $1 bills went for $43 million.

In another story a man gave $20 million to the local university to build a library.

Who could say anything bad about the library guy... but what about the buyer of the $43 millon artwork... what's your opinion about that person?
 
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