FaithNGod is offline FaithNGod Post #1  October 4,2009, 2:03pm
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This seems to be the question of our age. I hear this question all about me in many circles. I would like to help if I could to clear up any mis understandings concerning:

Why does God allow us to suffer and the question I hear is why does God send good people to hell.

If you have any other questions could we as a group address some of these issue together?
 
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JustbecauseIlikeIt is offline JustbecauseIlikeIt Post #2  October 4,2009, 4:59pm
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I believe that in our suffering we learn to rely on God. If we persevere we become more like his son. I can say this though because I live in a country where suffering doesn't mean watching my children die of starvation. In all honesty, I do not know why such things exist. I have rationed that it is the greed and sin of man, but honestly, I don't know if that is just an excuse I give my self in order to keep God fair in my mind. This is one of the hardest questions that Christians and non believers grapple with. I am interested to see what people say.
 
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FaithNGod is offline FaithNGod Post #3  October 5,2009, 3:56am
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I want everyone to know that before I begin to post my understanding of these things I am not minimizing your pain and suffering that you had gone through. I had gone through many tribulations and questioned God personally and even had a time of being angry toward God to the point I wanted to turn my back on Him. So when I share with you I want to let you know I completly understand the feelings associated with this.
 
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kevin76 is offline kevin76 Post #4  October 12,2009, 10:05am
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First of all, even knowing why I suffer doesn't make it feel any better. So for a person looking for relief from their suffering, a discussion of why isn't going to help them.

But it's still a valid question. The best answer I've ever seen is the book "The Problem of Pain" by CS Lewis. If you want a serious, in-depth answer, read that book. He addresses just about every angle of that question you can think of, from the suffering of the innocence to the question about a 'loving God' sending people to hell.

My brief answer would go something like this:
There are many, many reasons for suffering. Most of them are connected to the corruption of the world by sin, and God giving us free will (which necessarily involves the ability to cause pain.) Any benefit we gain from suffering is a side-effect. The original cause of suffering is sin - whether our own or somebody else's. Even disease and natural disasters are results of the corruption of creation because of sin.

Second, as to the question of how can God send 'good people' to hell - first you need to define 'good people.' Sin destroys goodness - a person who has sinned is no longer 'good' except perhaps in comparison to someone who is more corrupt than themselves. But the standard is not other people, the standard is perfection, and we all fall short of that.
I don't think God 'sends' anybody to hell - the people who go there are the people who have chosen to reject God. God doesn't condemn them against their will - in fact He gives them exactly what they want, an existence without Him. The problem is, any place without God is hell. If you choose to reject God, there is no other place you can go to get away from Him.

Anyway, that's the brief answer. Can't come close to covering it all in this little space.
 
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FaithNGod is offline FaithNGod Post #5  October 12,2009, 10:58am
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kevin76 wrote :
First of all, even knowing why I suffer doesn't make it feel any better. So for a person looking for relief from their suffering, a discussion of why isn't going to help them.

But it's still a valid question. The best answer I've ever seen is the book "The Problem of Pain" by CS Lewis. If you want a serious, in-depth answer, read that book. He addresses just about every angle of that question you can think of, from the suffering of the innocence to the question about a 'loving God' sending people to hell.

My brief answer would go something like this:
There are many, many reasons for suffering. Most of them are connected to the corruption of the world by sin, and God giving us free will (which necessarily involves the ability to cause pain.) Any benefit we gain from suffering is a side-effect. The original cause of suffering is sin - whether our own or somebody else's. Even disease and natural disasters are results of the corruption of creation because of sin.

Second, as to the question of how can God send 'good people' to hell - first you need to define 'good people.' Sin destroys goodness - a person who has sinned is no longer 'good' except perhaps in comparison to someone who is more corrupt than themselves. But the standard is not other people, the standard is perfection, and we all fall short of that.
I don't think God 'sends' anybody to hell - the people who go there are the people who have chosen to reject God. God doesn't condemn them against their will - in fact He gives them exactly what they want, an existence without Him. The problem is, any place without God is hell. If you choose to reject God, there is no other place you can go to get away from Him.

Anyway, that's the brief answer. Can't come close to covering it all in this little space.
I agree with you. if you go into the serpent/devil thread you will find a more detailed description of this I had posted in agreement with your response.
 
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chawks64 is offline chawks64 Post #6  October 12,2009, 7:43pm
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kevin76 wrote :
First of all, even knowing why I suffer doesn't make it feel any better. So for a person looking for relief from their suffering, a discussion of why isn't going to help them.

But it's still a valid question. The best answer I've ever seen is the book "The Problem of Pain" by CS Lewis. If you want a serious, in-depth answer, read that book. He addresses just about every angle of that question you can think of, from the suffering of the innocence to the question about a 'loving God' sending people to hell.

My brief answer would go something like this:
There are many, many reasons for suffering. Most of them are connected to the corruption of the world by sin, and God giving us free will (which necessarily involves the ability to cause pain.) Any benefit we gain from suffering is a side-effect. The original cause of suffering is sin - whether our own or somebody else's. Even disease and natural disasters are results of the corruption of creation because of sin.

Second, as to the question of how can God send 'good people' to hell - first you need to define 'good people.' Sin destroys goodness - a person who has sinned is no longer 'good' except perhaps in comparison to someone who is more corrupt than themselves. But the standard is not other people, the standard is perfection, and we all fall short of that.
I don't think God 'sends' anybody to hell - the people who go there are the people who have chosen to reject God. God doesn't condemn them against their will - in fact He gives them exactly what they want, an existence without Him. The problem is, any place without God is hell. If you choose to reject God, there is no other place you can go to get away from Him.

Anyway, that's the brief answer. Can't come close to covering it all in this little space.
Absolutely LOVE anything from CS Lewis. And I was taught the same thing, that hell was not all fire and a red guy with a pointy tail, it was the total abscence of God, so you really were getting for eternity what you chose in life.
 
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Avalon1k is offline Avalon1k Post #7  October 12,2009, 8:29pm
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God gave us free will. We are not puppets. We live in a fallen world that cries out to be made right and it will (someday soon). So living in a fallen world means pain as well as pleasure. It means you may be the victim of someone else's actions as well. No one gets through life unscathed (if they live long enough). It's not what we were designed for and our souls cry out for better. We were never made to be hurt as bad as we can be here. We were designed for Eden and to be with God.
 
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Preachers_Kid is offline Preachers_Kid Post #8  October 15,2009, 10:48pm
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The question How Can God? I think from a different angle and that is What is Gods' will for men? Is not that none should perish or suffer? So to say that God allows such things is a misrepresentation of God and what his word says. Basically what your saying is God is a liar. Since the death of Christ to redeem all of man what has been written that God has done to cause or allow suffering to humans? Is God not bound to his WORD? The Word that he said would not change or pass away. Honestly man causes and allows suffering. It is by our own choice or by the choice of one who has a evil heart an desires to destroy and control what God has set in order. It is the curse which causes sickness disease, but God through Jesus has redeemed us from the curse has he not? Do we so quickly forgot who we are in Christ? Do we so quickly forget the salvation an redemptive powers that God has bestowed upon us who are willing to recieve? Did Jesus not say seek ye first the kingdom of God and all these things would be added unto you. We do not suffer it is the lost who suffer. It is those who are in countries were God is not recognized who suffer. That is why God has purposed it into the heart of His children to be missionaries. To reach the lost or to support those who have that heart!!!!!! God has been through many generations been doing his work stretching his hands through countless generations to reach all the people on this whole planet!!!!! How dare anyone say that he allows when he alone has provided the way out of!!!!! He doesn't even need my defense what God has established to reach people speaks in his defense and who are we to accuse God of anything. I am only man.
 
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Preachers_Kid is offline Preachers_Kid Post #9  October 15,2009, 10:51pm
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As far as why does God send good people to hell. Jesus said why call me good. There are none good but my Father. Hell is a choice people make themselves when they refuse to accept God.
 
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JustbecauseIlikeIt is offline JustbecauseIlikeIt Post #10  October 17,2009, 12:04pm
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Preacher’s Kid,

I don't believe anyone was accusing God, but rather sin for the pain and suffering this world faces. Also, to believe that this country is free of suffering or is in some way more righteous than others in just plain blind. The United States is the land of free will, the modern day Saddam, where any and everything that feels good is permissible. In a land where the bible can be bought and read freely, where there is a church within a three mile radius of most homes, and a declaration of faith on our currency, we are known by the rest of the world for our immorality. The citizens of our great country are the number one buyers of little girls and boys sold into slavery. More than 25% of our women will be sexually assaulted. Our divorce rate is above 50% and being of Christian faith does not decrease this number. Abortion is legal. Drug and alcohol abuse is ramped as we try to medicate ourselves in order to deal with the pain our complete rejection of God causes. Homosexuality has become the new fad of our youth, most of which lose their virginity before they reach age 18 and engage in other sexual acts before 13. We pump their bodies full of fat and their minds full of sexually explicit lyrics, theatrical violence, and have all but completely removed God from their schools. And to support this way of life we submit to the god of money. We worship those who have it and we sale our souls to get it. Other countries, those we are trying to share the gospel with, follow our ten commandments better than we do. Let us be honest with ourselves. I believe the bible says to remove the log from our own eye before trying to remove the splinter from our brother’s. We send out missionaries to other countries while ours is going to hell as sure as the son did rise. Every nation must be saved, why not start with the one you’re in. Also, let’s make it clear that starvation is not a sin, having AIDS is not a sin, they are (maybe) signs that sin exists, but not necessarily the sin of those afflicted, it could be ours.

Let's look at ourselves with honest humility as our sin stains the same as theirs. The rain falls on the just and the unjust.
 
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