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StatGamer wrote :

lizard47 wrote :


Seriously no company is going to open themselves up for potential litagation by saying a former employee did not honor the two week notice because companies can request but cannot require an employee to give 2 weeks notice. Due to the fact that companies can be sued for giving determental information or for providing a glowing report for a substandard employee companies have gone to just providing dates of employment, reason for leaving, and eligible for rehire.





Unless you have a contract you signed specifying notice period. Scorpio did you sign anything when you first joined?
I signed papers saying that I understood the policiesand procedures listed in the Personnel Manual. One of those policies is that the company is an "at-will" employer, which means that a person can be let go without reason. Another section states that employees are expected to give a two-week notice if they are planning to quit.


One of my former co-workers quit two years ago,giving noticeon a Monday that the following Friday would be her last day.She was told not to stay out the week, but to leave after her shift was finished.


- January 11th, 2009, 10:21 pm
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StatGamer wrote :

If you were interviewing with me, I'd probably pick up the phone and call a person I knew at your previous company and have an informal chat with that friend. If I found out you'd quit without notice, I would not hire you because it suggests unprofessional behavior and lack of reliability (given that a person does not yet know you, they will believe this).
I do not know why employers feel that employees should give them two weeks notice before they move on when employers never give the employee two weeks notice that they are terminating or going to be laying them off.
- January 12th, 2009, 12:29 am
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Dear Scorpio,


Is sick leave an option for you? Would that help in giving you a few more days to mull over your options? As much anxiety as you're having, it is a legitimate illness, though you do not have to state your exact illness per se unless your employer requires you to. At some places, all an employee has to do is call in and say they're not feeling well or are feeling under the weather. An illness does not have to be physical.


I had a friend who was a social worker and she'd occasionally take what she called a "mental health" day.


There is a lot of pressure on you because of the sudden availability of this other temporary job that you don't want to lose.


I'm not advocating this, but I also know yet another person who was very unhappy at their job because of office politics, took vacation leave, went to work at the new job to see how they liked it, and then quit their regular job using their vacation as notice.


It sounds like your employer is a bit vengeful because of the way they had that other employee who only gave a week's notice not come back after she gave notice.


Will you need the health and other benefits of your current job? Will your health insurance extend for 30 days after you leave your job? Will you have the option to pick it up at your own expense?


Also, what's the very worst thing that could happen to you if you gave two weeks notice???


Just some more things to think about.


JavaJava5


- January 12th, 2009, 01:04 am
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Scorpio, I really feel for you. I just want to say that 2 weeks isn't so bad - in Australia there is no such thing as "at will" and your notice period is determined by how you are paid. So if you are paid monthly, as most office workers are, you are required to give a one months notice.


In some industries, like the education industry, you are required to give a school terms notice.


The employer is required to do the same, of course. Any new employer expects to wait 4 - 6 weeks for a new employee to start. No-one hands in their notice at the old job until they have a signed offer from the new employer - we NEVER leave a job without having one to go to - and often people will take a week or two of leave before starting the new job.


Or they can pay out the notice period if they want you to leave earlier.


From one of your later posts, it seems a fair chance that if you resign with the two weeks notice, they will tell you to leave at the end of your shift.


I agree with Statgamer, she makes extremely valid points - and never think the unofficial calls don't happen, they do.


I'd give the two weeks notice and tough it out - you will feel much better anyway because you will then know you are OUTTA THERE!! Plus there is the chance they will let you go at the end of the day. Plus you protect your professional reputation.


Good luck and let us know how it goes.
- January 12th, 2009, 04:17 am
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javajava5 wrote :

Dear Scorpio,


Is sick leave an option for you? Would that help in giving you a few more days to mull over your options? As much anxiety as you're having, it is a legitimate illness, though you do not have to state your exact illness per se unless your employer requires you to. At some places, all an employee has to do is call in and say they're not feeling well or are feeling under the weather. An illness does not have to be physical.


I had a friend who was a social worker and she'd occasionally take what she called a "mental health" day.


There is a lot of pressure on you because of the sudden availability of this other temporary job that you don't want to lose.


I'm not advocating this, but I also know yet another person who was very unhappy at their job because of office politics, took vacation leave, went to work at the new job to see how they liked it, and then quit their regular job using their vacation as notice.


It sounds like your employer is a bit vengeful because of the way they had that other employee who only gave a week's notice not come back after she gave notice.


Will you need the health and other benefits of your current job? Will your health insurance extend for 30 days after you leave your job? Will you have the option to pick it up at your own expense?


Also, what's the very worst thing that could happen to you if you gave two weeks notice???


Just some more things to think about.


JavaJava5

Hey, JJ5:


Sick leave is not an option for me. In bringing this problem to the boards I have chosen to exclude certain information because of the complexity of the situation and because I do not want to exacerbate thenegativity of it.Here is a summary of the problem:


- As some of you already know, I am a professional artist. I am an artist who actually paints pictures,participates in gallery shows, and alsohas work in museums, on magazinecovers and in other media. These are just a few things that a professional artist does.Like mostprofessional artistsI know, I must work another job to support myself because the art business is fickle.


-I took this currentjob nine years ago on a part-time basis, working only two days per week. Prior to that timeI had worked ten years at a major hospital in my state. I worked in an "upper crust" department and madenumerous contacts and good friendswhile there. Along with many of my co-workers, Itook a buyout when my position was discontinued.Throughout the years, I have remained in contact with many of my friends from the hospital. In fact, I am meeting for lunchone of my supervisors fromthat job on Wednesday. But we will be discussing elephants, not employment issues.


After leaving the hospital, Istarted my own business, using my buyout funds. The firstyear was good, the second year not so good.It was virtually impossible for me to run my business and continue topaint.


-In 2003, shortlyafter my mother died, I was still working part-time at this company. I left due to a disagreement with the company owner over a task that I declined to perform because I was not feeling well that day. I had come in anyway because they were short. Because of this,I was sent home andmy hours were cut in the interim.


I decided to take the high road by accepting what had happened, whileactively seeking other employment. For the next three weeks, I continued to come to work at the company18 hoursper week. At the end of that three week period, the owner of thecompany phoned me with a full-time job offer. She wanted me to return in the capacity of Team Leader/ Activities Coordinator.


I accepted the position because it would allow me to teach art to disabled people, which is something I had done in the past many years agoand enjoyed.There were also other duties involved, which have changed overa 5 year period. Because of the art factor and the freedom, I took the job with only the benefits of medical, dental and optical insurance. There were no paid vacations, no paidsick timeand no paid personal days. And there still is not.
- January 12th, 2009, 07:17 am
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Dear Scorpio,


Have you made a decision? Though it would be nice to hear what it is, please don't feel obligated to post something quite personal to you.


JavaJava5
- January 12th, 2009, 08:17 pm
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javajava5 wrote :

Dear Scorpio,


Have you made a decision? Though it would be nice to hear what it is, please don't feel obligated to post something quite personal to you.


JavaJava5
Hey, JJ5,


I thought I had made a decision, but am still vacillating.I am also weighing some options in terms of other opportunities.The good news is that the anxietyknots haveeased, and I'm beginning to feel more relaxed.


Thanks for asking, JJ5.
- January 12th, 2009, 08:45 pm
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Wow i'm actually surprised at what i've read here... on page 1 anyway. i truly believe that people in today's world have lost part of what it means to actually be alive, we stopping working to live and now it seems the general populations lives to work.


OP, you have written that you do not plan on using your current job as a reference - thats your answer right there. i don't know how things are where you live but i know that in the states i've lived they have what is referred to as the "right to work, right to fire". what this means is that you can walk into the office on any day and be fired for no other reasons than your boss doesn't like your socks. this applies to jobs from working at burgerking to a network admin position. employers for the most part have no loyalty to its employees in anyway, if they keep you on after they have decided to let you go, they do so simply to give them time to find your replacement, not to be loyal to you and they will not tell you until they have found your replacement in which case, its time for you to find the front door.


LEAVE, QUIT, SEE YA LATER! do not let a job become what its becoming for you - your biggest concern needs to be your own mental health, not this company. just do so with the understanding that they wouldn't be there as a good reference but by the sounds of it, they most likely wouldnt be there for that anyway.


don't let your job own your life - it's a job and not a way of life! unless your onw of the rare few that actually love their job in which case more power to you but that doesnt exactly sound like your situation.
- January 14th, 2009, 09:33 am
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bigfincat wrote :

StatGamer wrote :


LizziePooh wrote :


And people are right about the fact that ex-employers are limited in what they can say when called for a reference. The one telling question that is allowed is "Would you hire this person again?". The answer to that tells the potential employer all they need to know...


Officially you are limited. Tone however tells you a lot. And when I call unofficially, if there's good stuff to be said, people will say it.


These people are my friends. They don't want me to be saddled with a problem either. Liz is right in saying we're taking a risk; certainly we are. But it happens nonetheless.


If a person has called me for four different references and I wax poetic about the first three, and then tell you Name, date of hire, salary only for the fourth one, that tells you a lot right there.


2 problems with this:


1.) The unofficial calls are unethical.


2.) Companies are NOT loyal to any employee. Ihave seen too many people get mistreated by their company or corporation.


***Just me predicting the near future*** I am well aware that many companies are taking advantage of the current economic news as a way to trim fat. They have an excuse to lay off higher earning individuals now & when things get back on the upswing will higher younger, lesser paid employees to fill new positions.


Companies have no right to expect loyalty from anyone!!!
Exactly! do not feel you owe anything to this company - given the reservse, you think they would have any reservations about letting you go?


As for this some how making an impact on your reputation later on down the road... so long as you do not list them as a reference, i can't see how that could happen. i mean there is some far off chance that somebody from this company could leave and take a position else there that might put them in the HR or or some hiring dept. at a company your apply at but what are the likely chances of that happening? in addiditon to that, if it were to happen, most likely they left the company for the same reaosns you did.


i personally feel that employers have to much "ownership and control" of its empoyees. as bigfincat said, they economic issues we are facing today are giving companies to much power that they are gladly excepting and taking advantage of. they will cut you loose with no notice, they will replace you with somebody younger and pay them comsiderablely less than what you were making and not have a problem at all.


PEOPLE WAKE UP! take your lives back, stop living to work! everyone needs a job, thats a sad part of today's world that many are faced to do things everyday that they hate. we do them because we don't have a choice, rent isnt going to pay itself. don't be scared to take chances, if your this unhappy at your current job, find a new one and quit the old one and unless it was a company that was really good to you or you need their reference - quit! let them take the loss.





keys
- January 14th, 2009, 09:49 am
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mkeys81 wrote :

Exactly! do not feel you owe anything to this company - given the reservse, you think they would have any reservations about letting you go?


As for this some how making an impact on your reputation later on down the road... so long as you do not list them as a reference, i can't see how that could happen. i mean there is some far off chance that somebody from this company could leave and take a position else there that might put them in the HR or or some hiring dept. at a company your apply at but what are the likely chances of that happening? in addiditon to that, if it were to happen, most likely they left the company for the same reaosns you did.


i personally feel that employers have to much "ownership and control" of its empoyees . as bigfincat said, they economic issues we are facing today are giving companies to much power that they are gladly excepting and taking advantage of. they will cut you loose with no notice, they will replace you with somebody younger and pay them comsiderablely less than what you were making and not have a problem at all.


PEOPLE WAKE UP! take your lives back, stop living to work! everyone needs a job, thats a sad part of today's world that many are faced to do things everyday that they hate. we do them because we don't have a choice, rent isnt going to pay itself. don't be scared to take chances, if your this unhappy at your current job, find a new one and quit the old one and unless it was a company that was really good to you or you need their reference - quit! let them take the loss.





keys
I DO think the advice I gave is a way for Scorpio to protect her own reputation, to NOT let her expriences at one bad company affect her future working life.


I don't believe in giving someone else the power to hurt me (I have plenty of ways to hurt myself without their help!). Why create a problem when you don't need to?


Reduce the drama in your life, honor your committment no matter what the company would do, don't let your behavior be guided by other people but rather by what you know to be right and just, and all will be well.


Why take a chance? Work out your two weeks and call it a past experience from which you learned and move on.


- January 14th, 2009, 04:43 pm
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