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View Poll Results: Healthcare:
Don't change anything. 6 13.64%
Nationalize the healthcare industry. 11 25.00%
We need a public option. 17 38.64%
Promote co-ops to compete with private insurers. 9 20.45%
Other 6 13.64%
Multiple Choice Poll. Voters: 44. You may not vote on this poll

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DennisWisconsin DennisWisconsin is offline
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Will non-profit insurance co-ops be the compromise to compete head to head with private insurers?

YOU DO NOT HAVE TO JOIN THE GROUP TO VOTE AND NO ONE IS TRACKING YOUR VOTE, SO VOTE, PLEASE.
Last edited by DennisWisconsin; August 19th, 2009 at 03:24 pm.
- August 17th, 2009, 06:24 pm
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DennisWisconsin DennisWisconsin is offline
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Don't forget to vote in the poll at the top of the page! I tried to word the options as neutral as possible.
Last edited by DennisWisconsin; August 17th, 2009 at 07:00 pm.
- August 17th, 2009, 06:36 pm
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D_Lion D_Lion is offline
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I don’t think that any solution which retains deductibles or other out-of-pocket costs can address the moral issue of health access, and outcomes, being a function of economic resources. Therefore, a truly fully-paid system is needed (it could come from single-payer, or legislation governing insurer practice.)

I think mandates, while retaining the administrative nightmare of private, for profit, insurance is the worst of both worlds.

Since the US spends about double Britain, and leaves perhaps one-quarter of the population materially underserved, it follows that their system would eliminate the human rights effect of underserved persons, while lowering costs.

Single-payer is logically the most efficient system.
- August 17th, 2009, 07:18 pm
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DennisWisconsin DennisWisconsin is offline
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So you favor natonalizing the system? Don't forget to vote in the poll above...


YOU DO NOT HAVE TO JOIN THE GROUP TO VOTE AND NO ONE IS TRACKING YOUR VOTE, SO VOTE, PLEASE.
Last edited by DennisWisconsin; August 19th, 2009 at 03:24 pm.
- August 17th, 2009, 07:23 pm
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shoelace shoelace is offline
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Because of what's coming at us in the future with complete genetic knowledge of illness potential for everyone, from the time they are born, I think we may even need an amendment to the Constitution to guarantee healthcare as a right rather than a privilege just for those fortunate enough to have good genes.

The fact that you can be deprived of your life by being denied healthcare is already unconstitutional. The right to life is guaranteed (except for state executions). The Federal government is responsible for the welfare of its citizens. If its citizens are dying because they are denied healthcare--care that is readily available--the Federal government has the responsibility to resolve the problem, if at all possible.
Last edited by shoelace; August 18th, 2009 at 10:03 am. Reason: clarity
- August 18th, 2009, 10:01 am
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D_Lion D_Lion is offline
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Does the government have the responsibility to affect outcomes which are the result of specific personal choices?

Including, for example, substance abuse, tobacco use, obesity, inadequate or inappropriate dietary choice? And, if so, must the government extract funding for after-the-fact remedial care from others who did not make such choices, or may the government restrain such choice in the first place?

Also, is the public welfare best served by allowing any degree of medical service spending (for example, extreme measures taken at end-of-life, to extend life nominally – often in an unnatural way), or by rationing certain non-cost-effective care, in favor of funding other socially beneficial priorities?
Last edited by D_Lion; August 18th, 2009 at 03:53 pm.
- August 18th, 2009, 03:51 pm
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TaoShaffer TaoShaffer is offline
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I'd be in favor of examining the health insurance and health care industries to find areas where costs can be lowered and regulate price gouging.

Doing this would help address the "moral" problem while still keeping the capitalist model that has served us so well.

It may even help "co-ops" develop.

OH! And health education so people can stop saying "we didn't know this would give us cancer."

--Tao

--Tao
- August 18th, 2009, 05:21 pm
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LizziePooh LizziePooh is offline
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I think DLion brought up great questions.

The first question is one - should people be responsible for themselves or should the state take care of them?

And the second question - if the state is responsible for something like healthcare, then wouldn't that mean that the state does have the right to dictate lifestyles that affect health since they are footing the bill?

And for Dlion - still playing around with envisioning single payor. I still think it is a terrible idea - maybe just on principle but still mulling it around in my head. The only plus I have come up with so far is no litigation. Who are people going to sue??
- August 18th, 2009, 05:33 pm
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LizziePooh LizziePooh is offline
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And for Dennis' question, public option or co-op will both have severe consequences to rising healthcare costs and to losing private options.
- August 18th, 2009, 05:34 pm
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DennisWisconsin DennisWisconsin is offline
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LizziePooh wrote :
And for Dennis' question, public option or co-op will both have severe consequences to rising healthcare costs and to losing private options.
In the history of capitalism, when has competition ever risen prices?

So you love your insurance rates going up every year to the point where companies are forced to stop covering their employees.


So you love your insurance company reduces your coverage every year.

So you love your insurance company who denies your claims.

So what will you say when beyond your control you find yourself uninsured? You've got a thousand dollars a month for coverage?


YOU DO NOT HAVE TO JOIN THE GROUP TO VOTE AND NO ONE IS TRACKING YOUR VOTE, SO VOTE, PLEASE.
Last edited by DennisWisconsin; August 19th, 2009 at 03:25 pm.
- August 18th, 2009, 05:53 pm
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