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cardguy cardguy is offline
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I'm not sure what you mean by saying that it's only a belief of "ultra religious" people, it comes across as an attempt to dismiss a wide group of people by just lumping them into a homogeneous, faceless label.

Scripture is quite clear that sex it not simply a physical act, but has a spiritual bond to it as well (see Genesis 2 and 1 Corinthians 6). There are other scriptures I could cite as well, but I think it's important to realize the God doesn't simply express a list of prohibitions in scripture, but makes a positive statement of His design of human sexuality. I believe that scripture speaks plainly on this issue both in detailed verses and when considering the holistic expression of the Word on the matter, but I cannot force you to agree with me and as you seem quite hostile to the idea (forgive me if I have mistaken your tone) I will not attempt to do so.

May I ask what outcome you seek with this thread?
Last edited by cardguy; October 21st, 2009 at 02:37 pm.
- October 21st, 2009, 02:29 pm
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cardguy wrote :
but makes a positive statement of His design of human sexuality.
where in human sexuality does marriage even begin to fall in at? Marriage is a religious ceremony, not human nature.
- October 21st, 2009, 02:34 pm
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dwreese182 wrote :
where in human sexuality does marriage even begin to fall in at? Marriage is a religious ceremony, not human nature.
Since this conversation is taking place in the context of Christianity: marriage is not a human invention, but a gift from God going back to creation.

Although there are good reasons to wait until marriage for sex in a secular context, that's not the conversation taking place here.
- October 21st, 2009, 02:44 pm
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dwreese182 dwreese182 is offline
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cardguy wrote :
Since this conversation is taking place in the context of Christianity: marriage is not a human invention, but a gift from God going back to creation.
That is exactly what I said; "it's not human nature, it's a religious ceremony."
- October 21st, 2009, 02:49 pm
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dwreese182 wrote :
That is exactly what I said; "it's not human nature, it's a religious ceremony."
Well, then I'm not sure what you mean by "it's not human nature". From the Bible we know that man was created to be in partnership with woman, that the two should become one. So in the sense that it what we were designed for yes, it is human nature. On the other hand, we are certainly fallen creatures and often desire that which is not healthy for us. In that sense of human nature, I would agree that marriage is not human nature, for commitment, love, mutual submission, self-sacrifice....these are all things that our sinful nature struggles against.

Regardless, the statement "it's a religious ceremony" isn't accurate. A wedding is a ceremony, a marriage is a spiritual bond...not point in time or the product of a church but an ongoing commitment before God.
- October 21st, 2009, 02:57 pm
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Adrienne89 wrote :
The Bible does not prohibit premarital sex notwithstanding the pronouncements of many ultra religious people. Moreover, a vast majority of Christians believe that sex before marriage is important as a screening process for testing compatibility. Please give specific Biblical passages that forbid premarital sex, and not opinion generated extrapolations of general principles of immorality, etc. I'm a Christian and believe that premarital sex not be be in contravention of religious principles.
4Let marriage be had in honor among all, and let the bed be undefiled: for fornicators and adulterers God will judge.

3For this is the will of God, even your sanctification, that ye should abstain from fornication: 4That every one of you should know how to possess his vessel in sanctification and honour; 5Not in the lust of concupiscence, even as the Gentiles which know not God: 6That no man go beyond and defraud his brother in any matter: because that the Lord is the avenger of all such, as we also have forewarned you and testified. 7For God hath not called us unto uncleanness, but unto holiness. 8He therefore that despiseth, despiseth not man, but God, who hath also given unto us his holy Spirit.
I would like to know what you think of these scriptures.
- October 21st, 2009, 04:13 pm
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Adrienne89 wrote :
The Bible does not prohibit premarital sex notwithstanding the pronouncements of many ultra religious people. Moreover, a vast majority of Christians believe that sex before marriage is important as a screening process for testing compatibility. Please give specific Biblical passages that forbid premarital sex, and not opinion generated extrapolations of general principles of immorality, etc. I'm a Christian and believe that premarital sex not be be in contravention of religious principles.
The Bible does not expressly state that pre-marital sex is wrong. In those exact words. As I stated in an earlier post, the word pre-marital wasn't in use in the English language until around 1885, so we can hardly expect it to be present in Scriptures which were written well before.

Simply because I and some posters in this thread disagree with you does not make us ultra religious people. I am not sure if this is a comment you are making generally, or with regard to Christians you have personally encountered (online or real life) who happen to disagree with your viewpoint. How about considering that maybe, just maybe, this is a topic that we have given just as much thought and consideration and study to as have you?

'Moreover, a vast majority of Christians believe that sex before marriage is important as a screening process for testing compatibility.' Is this your opinion? Or have you read a study which has statistical data available for review? If the latter is true, please cite it so we may also read it. Thank you.

'Please give specific Biblical passages that forbid premarital sex, and not opinion generated extrapolations of general principles of immorality, etc.' Sexual immorality comes from two Greek words, one being translated as fornication and the other being translated as fornication, sexual immorality, immorality, harlotry, idolatry. If you do not accept that sexual immorality and pre-marital sex are one and the same; then verses such as Galations 5:16-26 are unlikely to be believed as forbidding pre-marital sex.

You've yet to cite Bible verses which state that sex, outside of marriage, is permitted. I think you should post the Bible verses from which you have drawn your conclusion.
Last edited by meri75; October 21st, 2009 at 04:19 pm. Reason: Clarification
- October 21st, 2009, 04:17 pm
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kevin76 wrote :
This was my experience too. In fact I felt more pressure was on me as the man to 'set an example' and 'lead the relationship toward purity.'
And when two members of the church had an affair it wasn't just the woman who took the blame for it - in fact there was a tendency to put more blame on the man (because he should have been a leader.)

1 Timothy 4:12

Don't let anyone look down on you because you are young, but set an example for the believers in speech, in life, in love, in faith and in purity.
Ditto.
- October 21st, 2009, 04:49 pm
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How many wives and concubines did Abraham have? Is there a single woman in the bible that has more then one husband? The bibles roles for women was mainly to be virgin brides, obedient wives, and loving mothers. The biblical view of women reflects nothing so much as the archaic bronze aged views of the men who wrote it.
Last edited by ANDR3W; October 23rd, 2009 at 03:08 pm. Reason: grammar
- October 23rd, 2009, 02:35 pm
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I am adopting a new atitude for whoever would push against the sanctification of their own bodies as professing christians.

I am no longer going to encourage you to live a Holy life that would honor God with your body by refraining from fornication. Instead I want to encourage you to do the very thing that you are going to do any way. That is to do what is right in your own eyes and live your life howevere you see fit.

Go ahead and fornicate away. Follow the old addage if it feels good then do it. I hope you enjoy you pleasure before the consequences catch up with you. But throw caution in the wind and for get consequences. Full steam ahead. Forget the future.They will never come your way. That is disease and pregnancy. If pregnancy comes you can always take the innocent life of your baby. But go ahead it feels really, really good!
- October 23rd, 2009, 05:18 pm
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