"Nice" guys... take notes on this.


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icthus24 is offline icthus24 Post #1  May 16,2009, 1:43pm
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So on every dating website, in every chat room, on every forum... there are always the guys who constantly complain about how women falsely advertise that they are looking for good men.

Let me explain something to you guys: they aren't falsely advertising. You're not living up to standards.

Here's the deal. When a guy goes looking for a woman, he wants someone who will capture his attention (physically and mentally). He wants her to be unique and stunning and stand out from the rest of the women around her. Pretty typical wants right? Of course. Deny it and you're really just pretending you are somehow different from the way that the rest of us were genetically programmed.

When a woman goes looking for a guy, she's really looking for the same thing. However, a woman is going to expect that you direct that stunning persona of yours AT her. You can't just exist and expect women to somehow find you interesting. That's never going to work.

As much as you may feel it's unfair, you have to be assertive. You have to get up off your scared butt, peel yourself away from the imprint on your couch, and really do something interesting to make a woman pay attention to you. Your existence doesn't qualify you for an amazing woman. Sorry... life sucks that way. If you'd like to continue whining, I can't stop you.

Here's my last tip though: the more you whine, the less likely you are to ever attract a woman who may have the slightest bit of attraction to you. You may attract a mommy figure, but that's about as far as it will get you.

I doubt anyone would qualify me as a "nice guy", but I'm not an idiot and definitely not a jerk. Quit playing the extremes and find a little bit of balance in your life... that could probably help with the spare tire and the 10 year old pair of jeans too.

Just sayin'...
 
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tbesq is offline tbesq Post #2  May 16,2009, 2:28pm
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Well ichtus, I'm sure your post will score lots of points with the ladies.

I agree with you, but I think the big problem some "nice guys" have is that these assertive guys don't always treat women well. Then the women come on here and complain about the lack of good men. What is your response to that?
 
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boccabum is offline boccabum Post #3  May 16,2009, 2:38pm
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I'll add: when women say they want a "nice guy", they mean a "non-jerk" but who is also interesting, self confident, and NOT A PUSH OVER. Fair enough.
But when timid, non-experienced, or over-enthusiastic, men hear that, they mis-interpret that. They say to themselves, "I'm a nice guy! I'll do anything a woman wants. I'll bend to her will and sacrifice my own needs for hers. I'll wine and dine her and try to buy her love. I'll convinceher that she should like me because I'm so nice" Wrong. Never works. I have yet to meet a woman say she's attracted to a wuss.
 
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tbesq is offline tbesq Post #4  May 16,2009, 2:44pm
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Yeah, that's really the extreme though. I don't think a lot of these "nice guys" are doormats. I just think that they need to find the women who don't look for the extremes (the biker, the rebel, the emotionally unavailable, etc.) I think there are plenty of women who just want men who treat them well. I don't think that means they're looking for a wuss.

If you're looking to date a woman who is not afraid to speak her mind, or who has a "strong" personality, her needs are going to be different from a woman who is more on the shy side and introspective.
 
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simplemind is offline simplemind Post #5  May 16,2009, 2:44pm
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Define, please.

What is "nice"?
 
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boccabum is offline boccabum Post #6  May 16,2009, 3:07pm
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tbesq wrote :
Yeah, that's really the extreme though. I don't think a lot of these "nice guys" are doormats. I just think that they need to find the women who don't look for the extremes (the biker, the rebel, the emotionally unavailable, etc.) I think there are plenty of women who just want men who treat them well. I don't think that means they're looking for a wuss.

If you're looking to date a woman who is not afraid to speak her mind, or who has a "strong" personality, her needs are going to be different from a woman who is more on the shy side and introspective.
I think that in the context of this post, "nice guy" is being posted precisely as a doormat. The confusion lies in the fact that guys that always act as doormats in their relationships think they're being "nice". They are. But they're way too nice. Women don't want jerks but they don't want wimps either.
 
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tbesq is offline tbesq Post #7  May 16,2009, 3:18pm
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Again bocca, I agree with that. Many women don't really know what they want, they just don't want boring. They will seemingly deal with any number of headaches from a guy who is "interesting." But yes, a guy who is afraid to challenge a woman when she's wrong, or a guy who spends way too much time following and not enough time leading, is going to have difficulty with dating.

To answer simplemind's question, I think it's difficult to really define what "nice" really means. Like many other terms of art in the dating world, it means different things to different people. But being a doormat will not get you very far, I think everybody can agree on that.
 
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boccabum is offline boccabum Post #8  May 16,2009, 3:33pm
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tbesq wrote :
Again bocca, I agree with that. Many women don't really know what they want, they just don't want boring. They will seemingly deal with any number of headaches from a guy who is "interesting." But yes, a guy who is afraid to challenge a woman when she's wrong, or a guy who spends way too much time following and not enough time leading, is going to have difficulty with dating.

To answer simplemind's question, I think it's difficult to really define what "nice" really means. Like many other terms of art in the dating world, it means different things to different people. But being a doormat will not get you very far, I think everybody can agree on that.
EXACTLY. Well put!
 
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simplemind is offline simplemind Post #9  May 16,2009, 4:35pm
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tbesq wrote :
... Many women don't really know what they want, they just don't want boring. They will seemingly deal with any number of headaches from a guy who is "interesting." But yes, a guy who is afraid to challenge a woman when she's wrong, or a guy who spends way too much time following and not enough time leading, is going to have difficulty with dating.

To answer simplemind's question, I think it's difficult to really define what "nice" really means. Like many other terms of art in the dating world, it means different things to different people. But being a doormat will not get you very far, I think everybody can agree on that.
Thanks, tbesq. Been giving a lot of thought to your answer, and I think I'd agree with most of it. Just as I might have been hard-pressed to tell you just what specific thing I love in a person, I might have a hard time telling you exactly what I want in him.

So I try to keep the outline clear, and then let the details happen. A good man, a nice man, is like a work of art.

Hopefully, he's not just a museum piece...
 
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peg099 is offline peg099 Post #10  May 16,2009, 5:37pm
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tbesq wrote :
Well ichtus, I'm sure your post will score lots of points with the ladies.

I agree with you, but I think the big problem some "nice guys" have is that these assertive guys don't always treat women well. Then the women come on here and complain about the lack of good men. What is your response to that?
There is a world of difference between a 'nice guy' and a good man.

'Nice guys' tend to define themselves by their niceness. Being 'nice' takes precendence over being authentic. They tend to be people-pleasers. They seem to walk around with the attitude that being 'nice' should be enough to get them a woman. Well it's not. Most of us have more than one characteristic we're looking for, which is exactly the OP's point. And if a woman doesn't like him because he hasn't developed any other qualities, then he lashes out and says women just want jerks. But the choice isn't solely between a 'nice guy' and a 'jerk'. There are plenty of good guys out there who have a ton of good qualities going for them. And, in my experience, the guys who whine loudest about women choosing the jerks tend to actually treat women no better than the jerks do.

A good man is respectful, but also genuine.

For more information http://advice.eharmony.com/boards/da...-not-nice.html (Resolved: "Nice Guys" are not nice.)
 
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