Ladies, what are your opinions on gender roles?


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NJGeek81 is offline NJGeek81 Post #1  June 3,2010, 10:25am
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I have a feeling this definitely isn't the kind of thing to bring up during the first couple of dates, but I imagine it has to come up sometime. First let me say that ever since I was a kid I have long despised the fringe end of the alpha male mentality. The bullying, the shallow misogyny, the "tough guy" BS. And then were the horror stories I grew up with about alcoholic fathers who yelled at their wives all the time or ordered them around the house (my dad was cool, but still). I swore that when I became a husband I would never be like that and would try my best to do an equal share and not get caught up in the whole "me man, you woman" stuff that women seemed to despise.

That was one side of the argument in my mind. The other can best be summed up with something I've observed many times over the years. I'd go to an annual BBQ that one of my aunts would host at her house and everybody would be over. Now, as best as I can tell, none of the men on my dad's side is an order barking misogynistic jerk and none of the women suffer from some kind of inferiority complex that says "my husband is the man of the house and his will must be done". Despite all that it always seemed to follow a traditional dynamic. The wives were happy to host and have family over. They'd do most of the cooking that didn't involve a grill (they left that to their fire loving men), set the tables, and when dinner was over they'd kick all the men out to have beers on the patio and BS amongst themselves while they cleaned everything up without a care.

I honestly don't know what to make of that. From a completely objective standpoint the workload is unfair. Yet, from a practical matter and a homey emotional standpoint, it just worked. I'd wonder if that's just because I'm a man and have the easier end of the bargain in many cases, but the women didn't mind it either and they weren't some pre-feminist era fossils either. So ladies, I'd love to hear your opinions on this because I honestly don't know what to think (without feeling guilty about it anyway).
 
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slaw is offline slaw Post #2  June 3,2010, 10:38am
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New Jersey man goes to annual BBQ, discovers men and women are different. Still refuses to believe it. Film at 11.
 
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hankscorpio is offline hankscorpio Post #3  June 3,2010, 10:50am

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NJGeek81 wrote :
I have a feeling this definitely isn't the kind of thing to bring up during the first couple of dates, but I imagine it has to come up sometime. First let me say that ever since I was a kid I have long despised the fringe end of the alpha male mentality. The bullying, the shallow misogyny, the "tough guy" BS. And then were the horror stories I grew up with about alcoholic fathers who yelled at their wives all the time or ordered them around the house (my dad was cool, but still). I swore that when I became a husband I would never be like that and would try my best to do an equal share and not get caught up in the whole "me man, you woman" stuff that women seemed to despise.

That was one side of the argument in my mind. The other can best be summed up with something I've observed many times over the years. I'd go to an annual BBQ that one of my aunts would host at her house and everybody would be over. Now, as best as I can tell, none of the men on my dad's side is an order barking misogynistic jerk and none of the women suffer from some kind of inferiority complex that says "my husband is the man of the house and his will must be done". Despite all that it always seemed to follow a traditional dynamic. The wives were happy to host and have family over. They'd do most of the cooking that didn't involve a grill (they left that to their fire loving men), set the tables, and when dinner was over they'd kick all the men out to have beers on the patio and BS amongst themselves while they cleaned everything up without a care.

I honestly don't know what to make of that. From a completely objective standpoint the workload is unfair. Yet, from a practical matter and a homey emotional standpoint, it just worked. I'd wonder if that's just because I'm a man and have the easier end of the bargain in many cases, but the women didn't mind it either and they weren't some pre-feminist era fossils either. So ladies, I'd love to hear your opinions on this because I honestly don't know what to think (without feeling guilty about it anyway).
NJG, I don't want to sound like I'm putting down women, because I'm not, but I really don't think you can gather much from how things were from your parents generation. 40+years ago when my parents (and maybe yours, too) were teenagers and young adults people were much different. Finding a woman who wasn't 50 pounds overweight was easy (overweight people were heavily in the minority) and women weren't treating prospective suitors as if they were interviewing someone for the job of supporting them for the rest of their life.

We live in a very different world than our parents did when they were our age.
 
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2clueless is offline 2clueless Post #4  June 3,2010, 10:51am
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I think that every person should have the skills or means to sustain an independent life. That means cooking, basic mechanics, household finance, basic cleaning etc. Hire it out, do it yourself, but get it done. Each of those skills should be valued equally and getting them done is a part of mature adulthood.

That said, in a couple, it's up to individuals to choose how they want to run their household. I am alone and I run my household in all aspects. If I were partnered, things would be different. But either way, all tasks need to be appreciated, respected and valued.

It's hard to judge the dynamics of the relationship from outside and some people might just derive a lot of joy from something like baking or cooking or attending to the outdoor space or fiddling with the car. Who is to judge?

As to the bbq, I adore cooking, meal planning and hosting and would not mind one bit taking the lead on those things. I love to cater to the ones I love. I don't see that as a traditional straightjacket. In a good relationship those things would be valued and counterbalanced with times when I am catered to.
 
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NJGeek81 is offline NJGeek81 Post #5  June 3,2010, 10:53am
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slaw wrote :
New Jersey man goes to annual BBQ, discovers men and women are different. Still refuses to believe it. Film at 11.
LOL! Good one smart@ss.

Seriously I wouldn't be asking this question were it not for how my previous marriage turned out where she didn't want anything to do with that stuff. On the way out the door she called me a misogynistic "womanizer" because of a 4 year long struggle of "why should I have to do that?", where I begged her to at least clean the house if she was going to work part time and be home at 1:30PM every day. As if I was supposed to agree that watching her 3-4 daily hour's worth of DVR programming and spending the rest of her time on MySpace/YoVille (where she eventually met the 22 year old kid from California she left me for) was the higher priority, even though I was working two jobs at the time. Right. We could never invite company over on account of it being so messy, and in truth she was a tad antisocial and didn't want company over to begin with. Enough issues for ya?
 
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jayjay is offline jayjay Post #6  June 3,2010, 10:53am
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Ok....we need some women's input here.

My own advice to the OP is to remember that there are many more possibilities other than misogynist and wussy. Also, decide what YOU want regarding gender roles and then look for a woman like that. Don't just see what is readily available and then settle for that. Best wishes.
 
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scarlet13 is offline scarlet13 Post #7  June 3,2010, 10:54am

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I'm far from a demure housewife, but i enjoy a clean, comfortable home and like to entertain. I can't stand yardwork. i do like beer though.

i think men and women fall into their roles organically. we are different after all- the only time it becomes an issue is when one gender defines the role for the other.
 
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TheThinker is offline TheThinker Post #8  June 3,2010, 11:05am
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A lot of people have agreements in their marriages as to what needs to be done, when it needs to be taken care of, and, who takes on what.

It doesn't mean a guy can't wash his own clothes or she can't trim the hedges, if need be.
But, for some reason they've worked it out, because it works for them. And nothing succeeds like success.

The problem, as I see it, comes about when either person, or both, starts to assume everything has to be taken care of by the other, because of gender.
Let's face it, no one likes to be shat on...

So, I think the lesson is, don't automatically assume that every little detail has to be split down the middle...and don't assume every other couple you see is somehow miserable because of that....
Relationships, like life, aren't black and white like that.
 
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Cape_Codder is offline Cape_Codder Post #9  June 3,2010, 11:16am

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[QUOTE=NJGeek81;999515]I have a feeling this definitely isn't the kind of thing to bring up during the first couple of dates, but I imagine it has to come up sometime.

Actually, I have to disagree with this statement.

The issue of gender roles comes up during the original communications process before you even get to open email communications.

Additionally, If you feel strongly about the issue, you can include a question regarding gender roles in the open-ended line of questions. The boiler plate questions eHa provides often times do not address issues of importance to me. I always draft my own questions concerning topics I want to cover and find that my matches appreciate the fact that I took the time to demonstrate some originality.
 
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vrjmcj is offline vrjmcj Post #10  June 3,2010, 11:40am
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We all need to be able to make it on our own. However I think that we all need to know where our place is! Some people dont know the truth anymore. Men are wired to be the provider and not women. But that is just what I think. I know that not many agree with me but i guess to each their own!
 
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