Traditional Roles in Dating and Life


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Can_I_just_be_Jo is offline Can_I_just_be_Jo Post #1  March 30,2010, 7:10am

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No not another who pays thread but more a looking at why we cling to traditional roles in dating and life even when faced that we are no longer traditional.

When discussion who pays I do understand the idea that the man pays. I have actually never dated a man that didn't expect to pay. If he did it wouldn't change my opinion of him but still it seems to be the norm.

What I never see discussed here is the flip side of this which is what traditional roles a man expects from a woman. By nine in the evening both Troy and I are dog tired. Still when he gets home there is dinner on the table, if he has had to do a lot of physical work that day I will rub his back. That need is no different than women expecting a man to pay for dinner.

Stilll he feels bad that I am ready to fall over asleep and still find the energy to treat him well. Appreciate that provider role. Yet he knows he is not the only provider and from that comes guilt. It is the same feeling I get if I were to allow him to always pay when we are out. I know I earn money and I can pay for some meals out. He knows he is not the only provider so I deserve a little pampering as well. And he does just as I pay part of the bills.

So where are we at with our untraditional world? Do we scrap both sides of the coin? I know that I don't want to stop pampering, caring for Troy. I derive pleasure from accepting that role. I know that deep down Troy feels like he should be the provider, he should pay.

I suppose we have worked it out in our little unit. I pay half the bills and depending on who needs it most we deal out the back rubs. We also share cooking responsibilities. It feels right, instead of just clinging to the traditional roles we have adapted to caring for the other. I wonder if that was what the traditional roles were born of anyway.
 
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nightling is offline nightling Post #2  March 30,2010, 8:41am
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I appreciate the moderators so much for moving this back to dating.
Last edited by nightling; March 30,2010 at 9:24am.
 
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PY_2 is offline PY_2 Post #3  March 30,2010, 8:42am

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Traditional or not, the reason why your relationship works with Troy because you base it on fairness and not gender based-entitlement.
 
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Can_I_just_be_Jo is offline Can_I_just_be_Jo Post #4  March 30,2010, 8:46am

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nightling wrote :
Why was this moved? It's clearly a dating topic or at the least, relationships. It doesn't belong over here in la la land with everything else.
I am trying to figure that one out too. I can almost see it moved somewhere in dating advice boards but off topic. Excuse me but how is this off topic?
PY_2 wrote :
Traditional or not, the reason why your relationship works with Troy because you base it on fairness and not gender based-entitlement.
This is true but our roles seem to be based on traditional gender roles. The difference is we respect and appreciate what the other does.
 
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ami1uwant is offline ami1uwant Post #5  March 30,2010, 8:49am
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I wouldnt expect you to make dinner.

Part of it is that we tend to be traditional and conservative in how we are raised and people tend to want to do what they are used to doing.


The crux of the problem isnt all that much different than the problems peole have with addiction.
 
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PY_2 is offline PY_2 Post #6  March 30,2010, 8:57am

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Can_I_just_be_Jo wrote :

This is true but our roles seem to be based on traditional gender roles. The difference is we respect and appreciate what the other does.
Yes this is my point...and from reading your posts, etc...I don't see any hint of "Do this for me first and I will try to reciprocate after a while, and I will also give back slightly less" (and I have seen this types of posts from the board). I don't know Troy and what he thinks about things, but I'd say overall it seems that your relationship works...so ya know...if it ain't broke
 
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Can_I_just_be_Jo is offline Can_I_just_be_Jo Post #7  March 30,2010, 8:58am

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ami1uwant wrote :
The crux of the problem isnt all that much different than the problems peole have with addiction.
I am not sure what you mean with this. Could you please explain?

Ya know with dinner they best nights are when we get home at the same time and cook together. I don't think there is anything wrong with enjoying cooking.
 
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nightling is offline nightling Post #8  March 30,2010, 9:00am
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ami1uwant wrote :
I wouldnt expect you to make dinner.

Part of it is that we tend to be traditional and conservative in how we are raised and people tend to want to do what they are used to doing.


The crux of the problem isnt all that much different than the problems peole have with addiction.
I think that's what she's saying though is Troy doesn't expect her to make dinner, yet she wants to bc on some basic instinct level it fills the female role in the relationship of a nurturer — which she wants to fill bc of her gender. It's traditional, but yet maybe not "fair" if you look at the overall workload ... she works as much outside the home, would like to sit down and maybe just watch TV too, but she also wants to do that second shift bc of the nurturing role. So she does both. And bc Troy appreciates it, the load doesn't seem as heavy and vice versa on him paying for dates perhaps.

PY has a great point too. When the other side shows entitlement about these basic instinct things that we feel impelled to do because of the way a particular gender wants to relate to the opposite sex, we start to get mad.

I see it in a lot of the threads that a guy actually doesn't mind paying for the date and some of even say they actually want to ... but they are mad about the entitled attitudes and they definitely want it to be appreciated. I think Jo is saying here she sees cases where the guy feels entitled to some things too that maybe aren't logically fair if you look at the burdens being distributed equitably, but she doesn't mind doing the extra work like fixing dinner she just wants it to be appreciated.

I can say from personal experience, that entitled attitude really wears thin after a while on a woman who is filling both the "modern woman working" role and the second shift "traditional" make dinner and nurture role. You get very tired of being treated like the workhorse with benefits.

I don't know if I am making any sense but I am running out of lunch break maybe post more later bye!!! lol
Last edited by nightling; March 30,2010 at 9:30am.
 
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Can_I_just_be_Jo is offline Can_I_just_be_Jo Post #9  March 30,2010, 9:03am

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PY_2 wrote :
Yes this is my point...and from reading your posts, etc...I don't see any hint of "Do this for me first and I will try to reciprocate after a while, and I will also give back slightly less" (and I have seen this types of posts from the board). I don't know Troy and what he thinks about things, but I'd say overall it seems that your relationship works...so ya know...if it ain't broke
I love how things are. I don't think there is anything to be gained by keeping score which is what I call the okay you did this so I will do this but not that cause you haven't earned that yet.
 
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eHA_Admin_Lori is offline eHA_Admin_Lori — Advice Official Moderator Post #10  March 30,2010, 9:39am
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Snipped for brevity to just the points I'm addressing

Can_I_just_be_Jo wrote :
So where are we at with our untraditional world? Do we scrap both sides of the coin?
In my opinion, successful couples operate as a team whose purpose is ensuring each other's well being, and the well being of the couple as a whole. I've read TONS of threads lately on topics from "who pays?" to whether or not women should wear skirts/dresses to please their man and I always come away with these questions:

-Why WOULDN'T you want to do something nice for your mate (as long as it isn't something that compromises you as a person)

and

-Assuming that something nice does NOT compromise you as person -- what are you afraid of losing, or not getting, by doing something nice for your love? It's not about "whose job it is" or should be to do anything from making dinner to buying dinner to taking out the trash to waking up for a crying baby (ok that's beyond dating, but you get my drift ) it's about each partner taking their turn to do something nice/caring/helpful/special for the person they love.

It seems to me that once couples become more about the individual "me me me" and not "you" or "us", their feet are upon the path of relationship failure.

Of course this doesn't mean that one should completely sacrifice themselves or a partner who is not at all appreciative or reciprocating, it's a CONSTANT give and take, I think, that makes a good strong relationship work.

nightling wrote :
I see it in a lot of the threads that a guy actually doesn't mind paying for the date and some of even say they actually want to ... but they are mad about the entitled attitudes and they definitely want it to be appreciated.

I think Jo is saying here she sees cases where the guy feels entitled to some things too that maybe aren't logically fair if you look at the burdens being distributed equitably, but she doesn't mind doing the extra work like fixing dinner but she wants it to be appreciated.
Yes, the sense of entitlement is lame, in my opinion. I think that by acting as if you are OWED something, that's a pretty great way to make sure that you either won't get it at all or in any case, won't get it for long (as in, no 2nd date).

And I think that there is NEVER a reason to hold back appreciation when your partner does something nice for you - no matter how small or grand the gesture. It's an expression of their feelings and it deserves to be acknowledged and appreciated, in my opinion.
 
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