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jayjay ....is feeling optimistic.

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Chances are the reason it didn't go any further isn't because you were too nice. Manners are always appreciated. If they're not, you're with a Philistine and should exit immediately.

Nor are all women fawning over alpha males. And, despite the popularity of "player" instructions and websites, most aren't looking for someone who'll play games by pretending to be less interested than they are.

But there are sometimes issues.

I have an acquaintance. Let's call him Luke. Luke thinks he's a good guy. He'll tell anyone who'll listen how nice he is. He's always helping and making himself available. In a relationship, he can't do enough for his partner.

Here's the problem. Luke does all that for himself. Without regard to how it makes his partner feel. Without regard to her boundaries (but I like her, so what's wrong with showing her I like her?). Without regard to her feedback that he's coming on a bit too strong, moving too quickly, or triggering a negative response in her. He's helpful even when she asks him not to be. Luke doesn't leave at that point, when he sees that they have different wants from a relationship, nor does he do the serious self-evaluation needed to see if he's capable of change. He stays. And keeps doing what he always does. When she leaves, Luke can't understand it. All he did was care about her and hold her in the highest regard. Even when she ends things, he hounds her to stay friends, and acts out some passive aggressive hostility when she declines the friendship. But what is he doing wrong? All he wants is to stay friends with someone he really cared about.

Do you see the problem here?

I don't know if this is what you're doing. I do know that there are a lot of self-proclaimed nice guys out there who really aren't that nice at all. If this dating thing is a pattern with you, you might look into that. Ask friends what their perceptions are of you in a relationship. And listen to the feedback without getting defensive.

Social intercourse requires us to have self-awareness and healthy boundaries in addition to being good. And it requires you to ask the question...good for whom?

Then again, they could just be idiots. I don't know. You're the only one who can answer that.
More of the self-proclaimed 'Lukes' that I"ve known are the type that are super pleasing to a woman initially....but then reveal a very selfish side and all that 'giving' stops before long.
- November 3rd, 2009, 06:53 pm
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Diann1950 wrote :
Women do like a nice, polite guy. But he has to also have a personality, opinions, values and the courage of his convictions. If you are just agreeable to everything, what do you care about. Even if I disagree with man, I will respect him and be attracted to him if he can stand up for himself. Sometimes that is very attractive.
Yes!

Being Nice is all well and good, but it's "nice" to have some passion as well.
- November 3rd, 2009, 06:55 pm
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jayjay wrote :
More of the self-proclaimed 'Lukes' that I"ve known are the type that are super pleasing to a woman initially....but then reveal a very selfish side and all that 'giving' stops before long.
Xactly! And on the extreme end of the scale, they are emotional manipulators and vampires. They'll suck the life right outta ya.
- November 3rd, 2009, 06:57 pm
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Thank you everybody for your replies.
I don't think I'm wishy-washy or the type of guy that doesn't have a opinion or can't stand up for himself. It's kind of hard to spend 9 years in the military and be that type of guy. I've got my own hobbies, passions and life, I'm not looking for a woman to give me one, I'm just looking for someone to share mine. The date ideas were all mine, and if they're not interested in me, just tell me your not interested. I'm not going to have my feeling's hurt because there are woman out there who don't like me, that's just life. I should probably listen to what I just said there and move on, right? I guess hearing "your too nice" and "your too old fashioned" after living down in Louisiana where that's completely unheard of just got to me, blew my mind a little
- November 3rd, 2009, 08:04 pm
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melman wrote :
A real person and not an amorphous blob of niceness.
*oozes all over this thread*
- November 3rd, 2009, 08:07 pm
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matt1982 wrote :
So I'm new to this posting thing... Hi Everybody! And I have a general question that probably doesn't need asking but I'm kind of fed up at the moment.

So the question is Are there any women out there that like the good guys? I was raised old fashioned and it was ground into my skull that you should always treat a woman with respect, I'm starting to wonder though if this is what women really want. I was told just yesterday that I was "too nice," all I did was open the doors for her and walked her to her car. This will be the 3rd first date in as many weeks, 1 "too old fashioned", 1 "too nice" and the other didn't reply to my call. Maybe the women and I see respectful as two different things?

Any comments?
I find it hard to believe that this has anything to do with opening doors for the ladies or treating them with respect. And as cute as that photo appears ... if that is really you ... I find it hard to believe that it has anything to do with lacking self-confidence either.

There is something else going on that you're either not aware of or not telling us.
- November 3rd, 2009, 08:23 pm
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nightling wrote :
There is something else going on that you're either not aware of or not telling us.
+1
- November 3rd, 2009, 08:27 pm
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LBMM, I agree -- I dated that guy not too long ago. His kindness wasn't true kindness; he did these things for himself, and to seek approval and reward. Trouble is, no reward was good enough for him. When we broke up, he made a very dramatic exit, and, once again, claimed he was a "nice guy" who was being wronged. Even though observers like his friends, family, and even my friends and family saw differently.
I think the term "nice guy" is a little unclear. A good man will be polite, attentive, assertive without being rude or demanding, and most importantly, will have a good heart.
The women that are rejecting you because you are "too nice" may not matter all that much -- after all, there are plenty of frogs one has to go through until...well, you know. When you meet the right one who gets you, you'll know -- just don't be a "Luke"!
- November 3rd, 2009, 08:28 pm
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LOL I have a feeling now "Don't be a Luke" will be an ehA-exclusive phrase just like 'she poofed on me' does.
- November 3rd, 2009, 08:39 pm
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Hi Matt,

Yeah...some welcome you got here...isn't it? Please forgive us...we have just hashed out the nice guy threads too many times around here.

As you can see from the responses and the experiences here...someone who has to claim they are a nice guy, usually isn't it. None of us know if you are that "nice guy" or not so please don't take our strong reaction personally...only you know if you fall in that category or not.

As for the three first dates not leading to second dates, I doubt that had anything to do with being a good guy. It probably is just more of the elusive chemistry thing that we all struggle with.

Good luck and welcome!


(And watch out for Peg when she sees this thread! lol! )
- November 3rd, 2009, 08:56 pm
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