Gender "expectations" - Good? Bad? Obsolete?


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peg099 is offline peg099 Post #11  November 13,2009, 9:00pm
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I think that sometimes we need to know something at a rational for quite some time before it really becomes a part of us.

It's like when people talk about not wanting to repeat past mistakes, and the men will say they don't want a drama queen and list all the criteria they DO want intelligence, confidence, etc. They'll meet 10 women, 9 of which match their new criteria and one which doesn't and is a drama queen. The only one they'll feel a 'spark' with is the drama queen. Women do the same thing - they'll replace one jerk with another.

I do think biology has some effect on who/what we find attractive, but I we're not bound by those things. If we identify that those attractions aren't really giving us what we want, it's possible to develop a greater appreciation for the qualities that are more consistent with our values.

I am no longer attracted to the same types of guys I used to be. I don't know when or exactly how that occurred, but it did, and now the things that attract me to a man - the things I will actually respond to on an emotional/physical level - are not the same as they used to be.

Sometimes we have to consciously challenge some of the messages we grew up with to examine how they shaped us, and to decide if we want to keep those 'gender assumptions'
 
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peg099 is offline peg099 Post #12  November 13,2009, 9:06pm
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TheWanderer wrote :
This isn't supposed to be a discussion about me, I'm just using my own experience as examples. It's supposed to be a discussion about the trend. And if "one of the guys" is for men what "nice guy" is for women.
Not for me. The behaviors I associate with the term 'nice guy' aren't behaviors I want to expose myself to with friends either.

If I friend zone a guy, it's usually either because there isn't enough compatibility in values, goals, intrests, etc or because I simply do not find him physically attractive.

The qualities I find appealing in friends are the same qualities I find appealing in a potential partner + physical attraction. But I don't need to have as much in common with a friend as with a life partner.
 
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w_elissa is offline w_elissa Post #13  November 14,2009, 7:47pm
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Well, I think I see what he is getting out. Here is what I think, people want an equal, but not someone all together obviously better than themselves. So, if the men and women have different rolls it's harder to say one is "better" than the other. When they start to compete or demonstrate skills in the same areas, it adds a different element.
I have to say that I find it difficult, because I am such a diverse mix and also require that in a match. I ski, camp, hike, and travel. I enjoy museums and broadway, I also have a masters and quite possibly plan to go further in my educational pursuits. I have ideas of one day opening a school of my own. When I look for a guy that likes to camp...he doesn't often have the ambition that I have. When I look for someone with the ambition and goals, he's lacking the sillyness and goofyness that I enjoy and that makes life fun. People shouldn't need to fit into any one catagory but be free to be a whole person. I want a guy who will hold me when I'm stressed and crying, but in the same fold, when he's had a hard day I'll lend an ear, and maybe backrub...etc. You get the picture.

As for the times changing...I'm not sure that's entirely true, there have always been those things going on behind closed doors, now it's just more in the open. (My mom is 67 and she's always the one who did the house repairs..built the deck and patio...fixed the roof and worked on the plumbing, but my dad did always bring home the larger paycheck....it's whatever works.)
 
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w_elissa is offline w_elissa Post #14  November 14,2009, 7:51pm
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Oh, and nice guy can often be code to mean he's a push over and weak. I don't think that is attractive in men or women. People need confidence to stand up for themselves.
 
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spartacus73 is offline spartacus73 Post #15  March 5,2010, 7:44pm

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Excellent writing, good thought process and humor! You got talent as a writer Yes I believe it's a product of a generation being raised by their mothers.

I'm very open minded, but believe all of this gender confusion is unhealthy. Mothernature is smarter than all of us.


TheWanderer wrote :
Is this a product of men being raised by their mothers and women by their fathers?
 
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spartacus73 is offline spartacus73 Post #16  March 5,2010, 7:53pm

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You were clear in your serious quest to find information. Btw when women changed the gender roles they forgot one thing. Usually men are the hunters in the dating game.

Today no matter how empowered a woman feels, if she has a great job and car, most women still have NOT crossed over to become hunters in the dating game. They are still waiting for the men to make the first move.

Food for thought.




TheWanderer wrote :
This isn't supposed to be a discussion about me, I'm just using my own experience as examples. It's supposed to be a discussion about the trend. And if "one of the guys" is for men what "nice guy" is for women.

But for the first two responses, yes, you've misunderstood me significantly.
Last edited by spartacus73; March 5,2010 at 7:55pm.
 
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funANDfair is offline funANDfair Post #17  March 6,2010, 8:31am
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Alright, I am new to the blogging idea, but I am not new to the "gender expectations" idea. I have what I think may be an interesting perspective on this.
I was raised as a farm girl, I held my own next to all the boys, and I was proud of that. But I was also taught the lady-like ideas, Iknew how to cook, I learned how to be polite and courtious, and get dressed up all "pretty".
I got married at a yound age and found myself in a very "gender specific" role. I WAS the bare-foot and pregnant little woman in the kitchen making the sandwich.

Now let me say this, he is an "ex" for reasons completely separate from the gnder specific role, but he taght me something very important.
As a woman who can hold her own next to a man I don't need to loose my girly nature to do that. I also don't need to loose my farm-girl tom-boy nature to be to girl in the kitchen.
I think what these women who are trying to be one of the guys need to learn is when to give that part of themselves the moment to shine while still keeping the part of them that makes them a woman.
I have found a healthy balance in my life when I can play around and be "the guy" with my guy friends and still go shopping, cook, do my make-up and flirt when the time is right for my girl side to come out.
I have to admit that all of my good guy friends that know how to hang out with th girls are nto attractive to me, there are roles that our genders place us in, this doesn't mean we can't blur those lines and enjoy it but somtimes we do need to show our partners that they are still with a loving woman.
Dating and love is all about compromise, she can compromise turning off the "be the guy" aspect in her life, when he compromises this same asspect, I think lots of girls lvoe to have the guy come in andcook a lovely dinner, or help equally with the house work. These aren'tthings that need to be placed on a certain gender. But need to be seen as a compromise ina relationship. Attitudes, and the way we act to be cool or fit in with the boys are things we can compromise.

Now as for the power suit beauties of downtown, that one I can't help you with as I am one of them. And I agree that your issue with attraction to these women may stem from being intimidated by them, but rests on you to figure out. These women aren't anything o be afraid of, they are simply women who have embraced their abilities and have worked very very hard to gain success in their lives for whatever reason, that is their own. Inside, they are the same shy women that you met and knew in highschool, simply with a better outfit and more experience on their shoulders. These are the women who have fought through life and succeeded, never given up, and are ready to stand side0by-side with their man in an equal, caring, accepting relationship.
 
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mrflyer is offline mrflyer Post #18  March 7,2010, 1:22pm
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One problem with discussing gender stuff is that it seems to be mixing different types of things- jobs, hobbies, skills, habits... no wonder we are so confused!

For example, I don't see anything inherently masculine in repairing cars. I know people of both sexes who are into that, and others who aren't.

If I get a flat tire, I pull out my cell and call AAA. That's what I pay them for. It's not because I'm incapable of changing a tire, but why risk getting hit by traffic if I can just sit there and let someone else do it, who does that for a living, has better tools and is more skilled at it?

Some of those supposedly masculine things are just disguised demands for someone to do stuff for you. If your toilet is clogged, don't call me, call a plumber. I'm sure if I said I feel like having cake, so I'll call a woman and ask her to come over and bake me one, that wouldn't go over well. I'd be told to bake my own or go to the store and buy one.
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mrflyer is offline mrflyer Post #19  March 7,2010, 1:25pm
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TheWanderer wrote :
This got me thinking about the inverse of that, which doesn't get a lot of press - the Cowgirl. She probably drives a 2005 Mustang. She can ski or snowboard; maybe even a black diamond. She can throw on some boots, skip the makeup, and hike a 14er without worrying about her safety or her nails.
I would find a woman like that to be great, as long as she wasn't upset that I can't stand up on skis and have never climbed anything higher than a ladder... but I suspect she'd probably want someone closer to her skill level.

I certainly wouldn't equate her with the one who sits around drinking beer and farting.
 
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username_already_exists is offline username_already_exists Post #20  March 10,2010, 12:51pm
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scarlet13 wrote :
Noone can resist a good kitten.
yep, the other white meat.
 
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