The Case for Separate Finances

The Case for Separate Finances

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The Case for Separate Finances


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swingingpolkajoe is offline swingingpolkajoe Post #21  March 27,2008, 4:44pm
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I enjoyed reading all the comments and will certainly integrate some of these ideas when I do find my soulmate.

Since many of us are older and have somewhat significant assets, perhaps some "family legacy" real estate and such things, a prenuptial agreement is something I personally will strongly consider. My main hesitancy is just how to bring up this topic in a correct and loving way ???

Any ideas for those of us in this boat ??
 
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cat_pat_1972 is offline cat_pat_1972 Post #22  March 27,2008, 6:17pm
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mikersj,74534 wrote :

If you cannot commit your finances to the relationship, then how can you commit your heart to the relationship. I think all the money has to be seen as part of the relationship, and there has to be an agreement on how to spend all the money. Just because it is in a separate account shouldn't keep it out of the relationship...It is all in the agreeing to what the budget groundrules are. It doesn't have anything to do with separate accounts.
Agree totally! If there are tough topics in your life and/or in your relationship, there is no gain in avoiding them. I also agree money is a really complex issue -- bcs we inevitably attach self worth to income. But in relationships (or even if you're alone) accountability is key. Can you make commitments about $$ and stick to them? Can you agree to mutual $$ goals and follow through? If not, there's either a skill deficit or a lack of commitment. Skills deficits are very common -- there's a lot we don't get taught. But commitment deficit? Think hard about this one bcs in my experience, it doesn't get better "all by itself!"
 
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fun_ull is offline fun_ull Post #23  March 27,2008, 7:07pm
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good article
 
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tomcat10 is offline tomcat10 Post #24  March 27,2008, 9:31pm
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My mother was a 50's bride and my father was the "breadwinner" of the family. In my teens I remember my mother telling me how she had to ask for more money for the kids and household expenses...they had one checkbook which my mother paid the bills out of for the household, credit cards, etc. My father had a savings account with himself primary and her secondary.She would often comment that she had no money of her own. Although my father never denied her any material thing she asked for herself orus kids. Her recommendation if we were to marry was that we each have our separate accounts and a household account which paid the household bills and childcare expenses.Plus a jointaccount for long-term savings. Additionally, she said if one spouse is a stay at home toparent, that individual should get an allowance deposited in their personal account to do with as they please. Pretty radical thinking for a50's bride, huh?

However, many of my female college friends who married in their late 30's, early 40's and had children... had joint accounts for household expenses, individual accounts for their and their spouses earnings and an account for child long-term expenses.However, they paid for their child's expenses, clothing, and private tuition, out of their income, not accessing their husbands income for any of the child care expenses., Go figure, these women were children of the 60's and 70's Women's Liberation. Doesn't sound too liberated to me...sounds like they're getting a bum deal paying for more of the expenses than their husband.

Unless their additional child care payments were done in the off chance they might divorce some day and could prove support in regards to their chidren and wanting custody (??)You tell me?
 
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codergrrl is offline codergrrl Post #25  March 28,2008, 12:42pm
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You should just marry a "sugar mommy" like my ex did. Then you won't have to worry about anything except negotiating how much the allowance is.
 
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vet4peace is offline vet4peace Post #26  March 30,2008, 6:23am
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NancyG,72366 wrote :

Separating the finances was a crucial step in alleviating the stress in my marriage. I highly recommend it.



Once we did that, we could see the other issues that needed to be addressed, and which had been overshadowed by the money. It also became clear that, contrary to what we had thought, we were individually capable of supporting ourselves. It made the separation and divorce process much calmer and simpler.
It seems that if the couple intends to stay married your suggestion of having separate accounts is a bad choice. My ex-wife and I have major problems with our spending habits. Since my salary was 3 times that of hers and her spending sprees werethree timesas frequent as mine, we decided to have separate accounts. This worked for several months untill I saw her credit card bills and numerous overdraft notices from our combined checking account. When we dicussed this problem I was threatened with divorce which inevitably occurred. Now she wants spousal support which guarentees her the level of spending she which is accustomed to. Does this seem fair?
 
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shulamit is offline shulamit Post #27  March 30,2008, 8:44am
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ThyFriend,75303 wrote :

Be aware, that without a pre-nup, it varies with each state (USA) if your spouse gets a share of an accountin only your name.
You are correct, and the handwritten kind scrawled on a restaurant napkin seldom hold up in court. The best pre-nups are drawn up by an attorney conversant with the laws in your state and s/he will need excruciatingly specific details of what you own and what you owe. Both parties are encouraged to obtain their own representation. This is not just for the movie stars,colleagues, but for anyone with an asset.The concept of pre-nups are easier on us who have a tradition for these (example: ketubah) but might seem untrusting and unromantic to those who don't.

Get used to it. Speak with an attorney. Read a few books on the subject. Don't be squeamish. RED FLAG: if someone you want to legally bind with doesn't want to sign one, be cautioned. It saved me from making a mistake with a NINJA and perhaps being forced to decide which half of my stuff I could get to keep.
 
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RobinCDB is offline RobinCDB Post #28  March 30,2008, 12:31pm
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Well, when I gotmarried in my early 20's to a medical student, I was all for the "we share everything" method of managing our finances. I was actually all for the "we share everything" methoduntil 17 years into the marriage, when he runs out and secretly gets a separate bank account because he's been cheating on me for God knows how long and is now thinking about divorcing me. Well, it's now year 19 of the marriage, he finally filed for divorce 7 months ago, and the money situation is positively insane. My lawyer says I should still come out of this okay, but I don't know. My suggestion is to maintain separate accounts and have a joint account for managing the household expenses and the children. Also, whatever you do, any assets you had prior to the marriage should never be merged, and any money that your family contributes should be placed in your account, not unless you and they keep accurate records of from where the money came.That also goes for any gifts of jewelry, cars, artwork, you name it. I was all caught up in the idea that he loved me and would never give me the shaft- that was one of the dumbest thingsI ever did. My new boyfriend and I have already discussed this and know this is the best way to go, particularly since his 18 year marriage has gone exactly the same as mine and he is about to lose the money he had before he married his wife. Once again, never merge what you had prior to the marriage with what you make together, and always keep something separate for yourself. And make sure you discuss all this before you say the "I do's," that you are honest about opening and/or maintaining a separate account, and that you are both okay with it.
 
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MissTrust is offline MissTrust Post #29  April 16,2008, 2:03pm
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Great article - and good advice that took me years to learn. If you are someone who respects your partner and their needs, and you truly have an open, honest relationship, then joint finances can and maybe should be the approach - provided your partner has the same attitude. But how many of us come across people who only look out for Numero Uno, or people whocome in with substantialdebt, or even children or support payments or a meddling ex... the list goes on. I think it's smart to protect yourself, no matter how "in love" you are (read: the blinders are on!) or how much of a trust issue it becomes - you have every right to control this very important aspect of your life - don't just hand it over to someone who is greedy, lazy or incompetent. You will lose and they may just walk away.

I havechildren from a previous marriage and later remarried someone with kids of his own - I'd say his only fault is that he loves his kids maybe a little TOO much. His ex had stripped him financially but he didn't seem to even notice - he was investing every ounce of time, energy and cash on his kids. I admired him for being such a good parent, and the addition of my income (we set up a joint account, but he did the books) made it possible for him to "take it up a notch" for his kids.I was OK with the expenditures at first, but as the years went on, IMO, he just took it too far at the expense of the new family he had committed to. Sorry, food, clothing, gasolineand shelter are ESSENTIAL. Playing a sport IS NOT.

We ended up losing our jobs after 9/11and most of the family scaled back to the basics.I found work again, but by then we were so far behind on even our basic bills.Our money was being spent on things I either didn't know about, or did not agree to, and I could never provide anything for my own kids (clothes, school supplies, etc). The end result was my kids' resentment toward me, my husband and the step-siblings. And I just couldn't understand why we were always living paycheck to paycheck. The math just didn't add up. We should have been able to pay every bill, and save plentyfor emergencies, but it wasn't happening.

Thefinal strawcame when his ex walked away from thousands of dollars in medical bills from one of his kids, claiming she had no money. Well, not for bills... Shesoon moved out of state, rented an expensive home, bought a new car and started a business.About this time, my husband approached me and saidwe would have to sell our home (or lose it in foreclosure) AND file bankrupcty. He had been trying to pay the medical bills ahead of our family's, probably to help protect her credit, while ours was sinking fast. As I sat there asking myself, "How did this happen?" I realized it was my faultfor havingno clue what all of our bills were, nor did I know wherethe few dollars we had were going.

I was ready to walk out on this whole mess, but then I decided that instead I would put my foot down and do the right thing for me & mine, for once.I've learned that no one can (orwill) help you - you've got to help yourself. You also have no control over other people - you can't make them change their ways, so all you can do isPROTECT YOURSELF - against everyone - even if it's someone you love. My husband's ex was feathering her nest whilewe weresteadily going down the tubes.

I finally had enough of all this nonsense,separatedour finances, split the bills equitably, made sure the bills I WASN'T paying on were NOT in my name, and developed a plan to invest inour future and retirement. somethingtht wasn't even on the radar up tothis point. I also now own my own home, and will never EVER lose it because someone else is so invested in their own cause that they neglect the rest of the family's financial situation.

How well did this work? There was a trust issue at first, but my husband came to see that I was not out for myself, but was trying to build a future for US. He has been more open with letting me know what is going on, so no more 'surprises'. I now have money to save and I am now able to doessential things forMY children without having to be told it might be weeks, months (or never) before the money isavailable. I can't stop his ex from costing us money we really don't have to spend, but I've stopped her bleeding my income away, at least. And I have made it clear I am not financing his kids' ventures-I have kids of my own. And iff he robs Peter to pay Paul, so his kids have their (non-essential) needs met, at least I will not lose MY house over it.

I agree that if youbring inyour own assets, or are financially stable, and you meet someone who is not, or even if there are children from a previous relationship -it isnotwrongto protect yourself. In my case there was really no other choice if I wanted to SAVE my marriage - I'd have preferred it the way it used to be (the joint account). Power to you if you can make that work! I wish I had done this from the start, it would have saved SO MUCH pain and anger, but I believe it's never too late to get your life back under your own control.
 
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whitegman is offline whitegman Post #30  April 17,2008, 3:54am
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What a joke, If two can't merge their check books in marriage don't expect a merging of anything else. Schedules, family, hopes and dreams will be the next victums. Yeah, its hard and self sacrificing but the reward is a heathly secure forever love. We live in a selfish world and self has never been more celibrated.
 
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